Selichos by Livestream: Minyan, Yud-Gimmel Middos, and Electronic Voices in Halachah

Transcript

This Torah class is brought to you by TorahAnytime.com. I now begin with the halacha. I've seen recently, people walk around with the cell phone. I think they don't call it a cell phone. My phone is called a cell phone. I guess they call it a smartphone. So I guess my cell phone is not that smart. Is that what the issue is? Okay. I guess smart people walk around with a cell phone. No, okay, we won't go there. Al kol panim, the smartphone, they have the koisel slichos. You can look on the phone and you'll see live slichos from the koisel, a live stream. Can one say slichos together with a live stream on the phone, and would that be considered like he is by the koisel saying slichos? That is the topic of tonight's shiur. Let me begin by telling you the details of what we need to address in this shaila. Let us begin by addressing what is the time to say slichos. When is the proper time? So if you look at the Mishnah Berurah, siman taf-kuf pei aleph, in the hakdamah, Mishnah Berurah says the time to say slichos is ashmores haboker, early morning. What is ashmores haboker? What time is that? Says the Mishnah Berurah, it's sof halayla, the end of the night. Sof halayla, it's the end of the night. Rav Elyashiv, zecher tzaddik livracha, says that it's actually netz hachamah. Because it's called boiker, so it's not sof halayla, the end of the night, but rather what? Netz hachamah. The Mateh Ephraim, in se'if yud aleph, says that actually you could even say slichos l'chatchila amud hashachar. It doesn't have to be night, it doesn't have to be netz; it could even be amud hashachar. Today, many do not say slichos that early. It's very hard to wake up that early. So you could say slichos before shachris, even if it's not early ashmores haboiker. Many poskim, Shlomo Zalman orbach, for example, said that for the yeshivas, they don't have to be makpid on saying slichos early, early morning. They could do it before shachris. Now, rabosai, but of course shachris in Eretz Yisrael is early morning. Let's just make sure we're clear about that, okay? If you find the minyan, your daily minyan is 12 o'clock shachris, I don't think that's what Reb Shlomo Zalman orbach was referring to. So if a person is learning in the yeshiva, it's a shaila of bitul Torah if he has to wake up so early, so he theoretically is okay if he says the slichos before shachris. How about after chatzos night? That actually is only a bedi'eved. The right time to say slichos is ashmores, early morning. Like I said, is early morning still night? Is it netz? Is it amud hashachar? Is it before shachris? But after chatzois at night is not the lechatchila time to say slichos. Ashkenaz, the first slichos is Motzoei Shabbos after chatzois. Big discussion why, and that has a lot to do with the fact that we just finished Shabbos, b'motzoei menuchah. So right after Shabbos, which is also about teshuvah, Shabbos, teshuvah, teshuvah, Shabbos, so we go straight into slichos, motzoei Shabbos. Lemaaseh, if a person did not say slichos early morning, he did not say slichos after chatzois night, b'di'eved you could say slichos the entire day. This is in Elef Hamagen. In Elef Hamagen, which is a peirush on the bottom of the Mateh Ephraim, it says clearly that kol hayom kosher to say slichos. Where is the issue? The issue is nighttime till chatzois. Mishnah Berurah brings down in tof kuf samech hei, se'if katan yud-beis, that you're not allowed to say slichos in the beginning of the night. Shaarei Teshuvah in Shulchan Aruch.

Says that one who is in a shul that they're saying slichos, what we call the ten o'clock slichos, says, Shaarei Teshuva, you should not say the slichos, and you should actually even protest the fact that they say the slichos. You look at the Yalkut Yosef, I believe he brings this, that slichos should not be said from nighttime till chatzos. After chatzos, b'di'eved, you could do it, but the correct time to say slichos is when? Ashmores haboker. Rav Moshe Feinstein in Igros Moshe, Orach Chaim chelek beis, siman kuf hei, says, and he introduces a chidush, that b'di'eved we could say slichos after nightfall till chatzos if and when needed, because people are not going to wake up early, so they may not say slichos, or they have to run to work. We could be meikel and say slichos from nightfall till chatzos. Rav Shlomo bases it on the fact that it's not really clear in Shulchan Aruch that it's a problem, so it's actually based on Zohar and other mekoros, yesh l'hakel if they're not going to say slichos. So this, that there's a crowd that says slichos at ten o'clock at night, it's based on the teshuva of Rav Moshe Feinstein that you could be meikel for those that need, are in a rush, or they can't wake up early, whatever the cheshbon might be, that they could do it. Yet there is an interesting teshuva. From Reb Chaim Berlin. The same psak is found in Arugas Habosem, in siman aleph. All the zmanim of churban, tikun chatzois, all is really based on what the time is in Eretz Yisrael. The Gemara is that the Ribono Shel Olam sits, bashmoiros, and He cries, and it's the time to cry for the churban, is what? According to Eretz Yisrael time. Now, I know that a lot of you, even though you live in America, you're also in America and Eretz Yisrael, the time—I don't know, I don't know what time zones, you know, maybe Australia, I don't know. But theoretically, many hold that these halachos we follow Eretz Yisrael, okay? So if it's in Eretz Yisrael, four o'clock, what time is it in Chutz Laaretz, in America? So it's before twelve. So according to that, you'd be allowed to say slichos when? At nine o'clock. Okay, this is an interesting point added to the topic: are you allowed to say slichos before chatzois? Why is this relevant? In Eretz Yisrael, they're saying slichos maybe six, five o'clock in the morning at the kosel. You want to say your slichos with them on this live stream, but you're not supposed to say slichos before twelve o'clock. But let's say, especially if I'm following exactly Eretz Yisroel, the koisel, then you'd be allowed to what? Say the slichos earlier than 12 o'clock. You'd be able to say the slichos. So this is one point that we need to address: the time. There's a different time zone, Eretz Yisroel, America. So if I'm saying slichos earlier, but I'm saying it with Eretz Yisroel, koisel, through the live stream, would that be an issue? There's another issue. Slichos should be, should be said with a minyan. Mishnah Berurah, siman taf-kuf pei aleph, says that lechatchilah, the right thing is to say slichos with a minyan. Am I saying slichos with a minyan? I'm here alone, yet the koisel is what, thousands of people. Could we consider the fact that I'm saying it through this technology like I'm there and I'm part of a minyan? Interesting question. How about Yud-Gimmel Middos? Are you allowed to say Yud-Gimmel Middos without a minyan? Are you allowed to say Hashem, Hashem, Kel Rachum v'Chanun without—

Reb Chaim Kanievsky says you should not say Yud-Gimmel Midos unless you have a minyan. I saw many other poskim, Reb Shlomo Zalman, says that you could say Yud-Gimmel Midos without a minyan. In Yalkut Yosef, brought down, that if you say it with the ta'amei haTorah, like you're reading in the Torah, then it's okay to say Yud-Gimmel Midos without a minyan. So here's the question: if I'm — in Yiddish there's an expression, shtellen tzu — if I'm connecting with the minyan that's by the kosel, am I allowed to say what? The Yud-Gimmel Midos together with the people there. There's another issue, and that is some of the selichos is in Aramaic. Machi u'masi. Mishnah Berurah in siman taf-kuf-peh aleph, se'if katan daled, says that anything Aramaic in the selichos should not be said unless you have a minyan. The reason for this is, when you have a minyan, you don't need malachim, you don't need the angels. Now, rabosai, pick your heads up. Every time I say the word malach, or gilgul, or mazal, or segulah, you need to pick your head up to show me that you're awake, okay? So the malachim are not needed if you daven with a minyan. Yet, if I daven without a minyan, without a tzibur of ten people, I need what? I need the help of the— Malachim. Malachim do not understand Aramaic. They do not understand Aramaic. That's why the Kaddish is in Aramaic, because it's such a lofty tefillah. We don't want the malachim to understand. Point being, machi u'masi cannot be said b'yechidus unless you have a minyan. So here's the question: if I'm saying the slichos together with the people in Eretz Yisrael by the kosel, can I say machi u'masi? So let's repeat again. What are the issues? You have your smartphone. Is that what it's called, a smartphone? Yes, okay. You have your smartphone, and you're seeing it the way thousands of people are saying slichos by the kosel. Can you, A, say slichos at that time, even though it's before chatzos for you? Could you say slichos even though you're alone, you're not with a minyan? Could you say the Yud-Gimmel Midos? Could you say machi u'masi? Rabosai, let's discuss the halacha of technology. You have a microphone. We have a telephone. We have a tape recorder. We have a radio, and we have an internet. These are all forms of communication, of bringing information. Now notice I skipped one of them because that one is asur, and I hope you're not going to say slichos with a— okay, no? Okay. So again, we have the phone, right? We have the microphone. We also have a hearing aid. It's also a technology that lets me, what, communicate information that is said. Where into my— Here. What happens with all this technology, l'gabei Megillah, shofar? Can I be yotzei by hearing it through the means of all these different technologies? So this we'll discuss now. Rav Moshe Feinstein in the teshuvos, in Orach Chaim chelek daled, siman tzadi aleph, os daled, says that b'di'eved, you can hear havdalah through a telephone. This is a very relevant halacha, rabosai. A lot of times a woman has a baby, she'll be in a hospital. The husband went home to take care of the kids. She needs to hear havdalah. How does she hear havdalah? We all know women don't make havdalah, and they definitely don't drink from the havdalah, because if they drink from the havdalah, right, everybody knows what happens. What? No, nobody knows? Everybody knows, right? Okay, so let me tell you the real truth. That's not going to happen, okay? If you drink from the havdalah, that's not going—you're not going to grow a beard. That's not true. As a matter of fact, l'halacha, if they do make havdalah, they're mechuyav to drink from the havdalah. Unless you say, once you're mechuyav, so oseh mitzvah lo yeira'eh davar ra, nothing bad could happen. Simply.

A lot of these things that we want people shouldn't do, we frighten them with consequences. For example, if we don't want someone to step over another person, which is a Gemara, you should not be stepping over people. What do we tell them? You won't grow if you step over the person, right? What's the reason for this? The reason for this is that the person who is being stepped over will say, Don't step over me, please. I'm not going to grow if you step over me. It's really a means of how to protect people stepping over. So what do they tell you? So go back. In case you step over him, go back. Rabosai, it's a shtus v'hevel, because the whole idea of not stepping over the person is because you might step on him. So what do you tell the person? Go and fix it and step back over him, right? This is when you don't know the reason for the halacha, and you just frighten the person with side, what do you call, concerns, so he doesn't understand. So he says, You better go step back over. L'maaseh, the reason why women don't make havdalah has a lot to do with are they mechuyav in havdalah. That's the real issue. Are women mechuyav in havdalah? So in case they can't make havdalah, meaning they can't hear the havdalah from somebody else, so then they should make havdalah. But here we have a good solution, and that is that they should hear the havdalah via telephone. Says Rav Moshe, b'di'eved that's okay, that if someone is in a hospital and he hears the havdalah through a telephone, is he yotzei or no? And the answer is b'di'eved you're yotzei. How about the microphone? One of the most big, controversial topics in halacha: the microphone. R' Moshe, in Orach Chaim chelek daled, siman pei daled, says that what you hear from the microphone is not the same voice as my voice. Okay, so if someone said, I didn't hear Rabbi Wolkin tonight, so it's very possible because he was daydreaming, he was sleeping, or because he understood the shiur, and he understood that because I said it through a microphone, you didn't hear my voice, but you heard what? A new reconstructed voice. Reb Shlomo Zalman Auerbach, in Minchas Shlomo, says an interesting chiddush. So what happens if I'm in a shul here, and I make a bracha, I say a tefillah, I say Shemoneh Esrei, such a big congregation of people, so I talk and I say the shliach tzibbur into the microphone. Could you answer amen to it? Could you answer amen, and are you yotzei the shliach tzibbur tefillah through the microphone? Now, I'm not discussing Shabbos and the microphone, that you'll have to— that's a very big controversial topic, not for tonight. But the point is, during the week, many people, microphone, and the answer says Reb Shlomo Zalman Auerbach, if it's not the same voice, it's a reconstructed voice, then maybe not. So if you're able to hear me anyway, but it adds, it adds, the microphone adds to the sound, and now I hear the shliach tzibbur better. Then I can answer, Amen, and I heard the shliach tzibbur. So this is a very interesting halacha. Many said, What do you mean? But it's my voice. You hear it through the microphone. And many said, No. If you understand the technology and the way the waves and the sound, and there's other elements that get mixed into the sound, and therefore it's not my original voice; it's a new reconstructed voice. You know where the nafkamina would be? If someone has hearing aids. He's listening to the shofar, and he's listening through hearing aids because he doesn't hear properly. Many held that that's not called hearing shofar, but it's hearing a reconstructed through the hearing aid kol of shofar. Now, I see a lot of you are shaking your heads, okay? There's big machloikes. There's big issues about it. Many want to say that there would be a very big difference between megillah and shofar. Megillah, you could be able to hear through a hearing aid or a microphone because at the end of the day, I don't need the actual kol, but I need to hear the words from a baal koreh. I hear it; it goes through the microphone into the, or the hearing aid.

But where the shofar? What do you need to hear, rabosai? Together, let's go. What do you need to hear? Lishmoya kol shofar. If you notice, it doesn't say, Lishmoya kol megillah. You need mikra megillah, the reading of a megillah. But when you need what? The kol of the shofar. Many want to say that through a microphone. Now, of course, there's no microphones in shul on Rosh Hashanah, but you can have a hearing aid, that that might be somewhat of an issue. Megillah through a microphone. Rav Moshe Feinstein in Igros Moshe, Chelek Beis, siman kuf chaf ches, and many other gedolim have dealt with that question, if you could hear a megillah through a microphone. What would be an interesting she'eilah? So, for example, if someone is in a hospital, chas v'shalom, lo aleichem, it's difficult for him to come down to the main lobby where the shul is. He's in his room. Can he hear kol shofar through telephone, via telephone? For example, they open the telephone before Yom Tov, or maybe a nurse will come and open the—put the telephone down, and he hears the kol shofar from the synagogue, from the shul in the hospital. Would that suffice for what? For hearing kol shofar. Telephone is one sugya. Microphone is a different sugya. And what? And hearing aid is a different sugya. But you know what would be interesting, rabosai? I know Sefardim don't blow shofar. In Elul, it's interesting, they say slichos in an entire Elul, while Ashkenazim blow shofar an entire Elul. Can I hear that shofar via telephone? Can I hear? I see, rabosai, the oilam is not listening. I have a hard time. I'll explain to you why. I have a microphone, and I could scream very loud, Baruch Hashem, and if I have to wake you up by screaming, maybe I should just do that, okay? So, rabosai, pay attention. Can I hear the kol shofar of Elul via telephone? And the answer probably is, of course. Why? When you blow shofar on Elul, during Elul, it's not kol shofar. You don't need what? The actual kol shofar. What do you need? You need the reminder that the shofar brings to do teshuva. So you have it. Unless you say no, then obviously if I want to remind you to do teshuva, why not just get up and scream, Do teshuva? Obviously you need to hear the shofar. Probably, lanias daati, mistama, you could yotzei the shofar blowing of Elul via a telephone. Okay. How about radio? I hear slichos on the radio. Can I be yotzei? I hear a bracha on the radio. Can I be yotzei? Chacham Ovadia, the children of Chacham Ovadia pasken that as long as it's live, then you can answer amen as if you were there via radio. But if it's not a live broadcast, you cannot. I've heard in the past people ask, but wait a minute, there's no such thing as live. There's always delay, seven-second delay. All right, no, no. But this is basically the halacha, that as long as it's considered more or less while live streaming, then it would be okay to hear from a radio, and it's considered what? As if I heard it direct, and I could say amen to the bracha. How about from a tape recorder, rabosai? How about from a tape recorder? Today, we don't like live almost, you know. If you take a look, I'm talking here, and it has to be through the camera. And thousands, that's what I was told, thousands of people are listening to this shiur. Is that what you told me? Was it tens of thousands? No. Okay, al kol panim, it needs to be through what? Through a media. Mitatzelta ma'aseh. There's a very cute anecdote that was said over. There was once a teacher, a rebbi, that wanted to go on vacation for a week, but he had a job, he had to teach. So he thought to himself, let me take a tape. I'll make the class, the shiur, on a tape. I'll bring it into the classroom and I'll play the tape.

And like this, I could go wherever I have to go in Yoitza. The first day, second day, third day, he doesn't hear from the principal asking, how come he doesn't show up in class? So he wanted to see how it's going. It must be going well. It must be a good method on how to teach, because, you know, he comes, he looks through the window, and he sees not one attendee to the class. Every person brought a tape recorder to tape what the tape recorder that he put down was taping. He taught it through a tape recorder, and they what? They said, okay, so we'll do the same thing. We'll listen through the tape recorder, and they also didn't show up. I always say to my students, you know, maybe I should text you the shiur to your phone. Maybe then you'll listen, because when I say it live... Okay, the point being, what happens if I listen to a bracha on a tape recorder? So, Rav Moshe Feinstein, in Yoreh Deah chelek aleph, siman kuf ayin gimel, says that if a person would tape a Shem Hashem, the name of Hashem, on a tape recorder, this would not be a problem of mechikah, of erasing the name of Hashem. This would maybe not be a problem, and a person does not being over of saying the Shem Hashem lashav when he replays it. For example, every time you replay the name of Hashem. Maybe it's considered saying the name of Hashem in vain. Says Rav Moshe, not a problem. This is not, because this is not called what you say it. Saying it through the tape. You said it on the tape, and now you're playing the tape. Rabbi Yaakov Kamenetsky held not like that. Rabbi Yaakov held that you should never say the Shem of Hashem on a tape, and I guess a CD, because it was before its tapes, because every time you replay it, what are you being over? Saying the Shem Hashem lashav. Very interesting psak halacha. Obviously the world isn't makpid on it. This is an Emes l'Yaakov, Yoreh Deah, siman reish ayin vav. How about erasing a tape? How about erasing something on a computer? A bracha. So this is an interesting famous question. Rav Moshe Feinstein says that l'choira, erasing should be mechirah. It seems like you're erasing, and therefore it's mechuar. It's something which is not correct to do. So for example, to erase a tape that has the Shem Hashem, Rav Moshe held you shouldn't do it. And then in other teshuvos, for example, Chelek Beis of Orach Chaim, siman kuf mem beis, Rav Moshe says if you're going to do it, do it through a grama, which means don't directly erase it. Figure out a way how it should be a grama. It means in a roundabout way that you erase it. Yechaveh Daas, Chacham Ovadia, in siman nun, says clearly, and he's very vehement about it, that there is no problem of erasing. A tape that has a bracha, has a shem Hashem, because it's nothing, it's not there. It's codes, it's not exactly the words, and therefore there's no problem whatsoever. And he writes very sharp language against those that forbid it. It's interesting, when you write on a computer, is that called writing in general? That's a very interesting—everyone's shaking their heads like they're big poskim. That's good, okay, I'm happy. Everyone is a big posek in his own mind. Okay, it's all good. So let me tell you, many gedolim and poskim say that it's not exactly called writing, which really is, what, rabosai, the flip of this teshuva, that what? That it's not called erasing, right? The same way it's not there and I can erase it, if I wrote it, I didn't really write anything. So on Shabbos, if I write on a computer, would it be chayav for koisev? It's a big topic. Many say that this would be relevant to a doctor in a hospital, where sometimes the doctor has to write a prescription on Shabbos for a patient, or he has to write a report. He'd be better off to write it on a computer than to write it with a pen on a piece of paper, because writing on a piece of paper would be koisev on Shabbos. To write on the computer maybe is not called ksiva. Final last issue, can I answer amen to—

Something I hear on a telephone. Rabbi Moshe Nigros Moshe, chelek daled, siman tzadi aleph. Obviously, just like Havdalah you can hear on a telephone, so you can answer amen. Why not? It's the same thing. But on a tape, if someone played a tape and you heard a bracha, says Rav Moshe, you do not answer amen. So now let's fast forward to modern-day technology of internet, your smartphone. If I hear slichos on the smartphone, nu, is it considered what, like I heard the yud-gimmel midos? Is it amen? Can I answer amen? And the truth is this is a little bit even of a bigger question. Why? All the other technology, all you see is what? Sorry, all you have is the voice. The voice goes through the phone. You don't see my face. You don't see the person. I know we have technology of having phones today with face—what's it called in English, when you have it, you can see the—huh? FaceTime. Okay. Al kol panim, most of the issues in the halacha were about the technology of delivering the voice from the speaker to the ear of the hearer. Now we have, what, the internet, where the phone and the internet is giving me the actual live that's happening as well. So here's the question: do I have not only the bracha, but do I have it as if I'm there connecting to what's going on over there to the point that I have a minyan, maybe? This is a very, very long, interesting topic that needs a lot of time. We will end over here, but this was the point. The point was to under— yes, what's your question? The what? If it's mutar aser? You see, I'm smiling. What do you want me to tell you, that it's mutar or aser? I could tell you like this: the issues that I brought up are technically mutar anyway. That's the real truth. You're allowed to say slichos— no, I'm saying you're allowed to say slichos anyway alone. You're allowed to say Yud Gimel Midos according to many anyway alone. You're allowed to say slichos at any given time during the day anyway, based on Eretz Yisrael, anyway. So the only issue is, do you actually look at the person being by the kosel and davening? So even if not, the issue is really theoretically mute. Technically, you should be allowed to say it anyway. So I would tell you that it should be mutar. Now I wish you a good night, and we should all be zocheh to both say slichos and in Eretz Yisrael by the kosel, bimheira b'yameinu, amen. You've just experienced another Torah class, brought to you by TorahAnytime.com.