Tisha B’Av: The Kedushah of the Beis Hamikdash After the Churban and the Obligation to Mourn

Transcript

The Biat mechorfei El, b'soch Mikdash hadareha. So I'll be asking on the entering, on the entering of mechorfei El. Thank you very much. Those who are mecharef. Mecharef means they, they speak chirufim. They speak, be'er against Hashem, mechorfei El, hadareha. Within the Mikdash, which is hadareha, is beauty. So what exactly is the kinah? The biat mechorf, that they came, that the mechorfei El, chirufim, came b'soch Mikdash hadareha. So pashut you could say that we find many aggadot. We find many aggadot. Okay, nisht tzigeher, it's not important. Nisht tzukum. My recollection is that they do say it, but whatever it is. The al biat mechorfei El b'soch Mikdash hadareha. So what exactly is the kinah here? What are we crying about? That's kinot? So the question is, what's the biat mechorfei El? What are we crying about? They came, they entered, those that were mecharef El, that they spoke against Hashem, chirufim. So truth is, our Gemara is about this, that Titus Harasha was mecharef Hashem. He's still against Hashem in the Beis Hamikdash. The Gemara in Gittin, a very famous Gemara. Yeah. It says like this. Gemara says, Gemara is nun-vav amud beis. Chasim ka. What's mi kamaicha chasim ka? Shata shemeya ni'utzoi vegidufoi, shelo oisah rasha v'shoysek. Because, Baruch Hu hears the chirufim and gidufim. You see the Gemara, mi kamaicha? Tana. Mi kamaicha? What's the pshat? You have the Gemara, Abba Chanan oimer, mi kamaicha chasim ka. Mi kamaicha chasim v'kasha. Who's able to hold himself back? That what? Shata shemeya ni'utzoi vegidufoi shelo oisah rasha v'shoysek. Titus. Going back on Titus. So Titus was mecharef, megadef et HaKadosh Baruch Hu, and you know the story with Titus, that the bug went in his nose, that's Titus. That was his onesh for being mecharef u'megadef es Hashem. So that's pashut pshat here. V'al bias mecharfei Kel, and the coming of those that were mecharef Hashem means Titus. Titus came into the Beis HaMikdash. In Avodah Zarah also we find the same thing about Titus. Al tivi'uni regel gaiva, ze Titus harasha. This is Titus harasha, shenischaku atzmosav, that his bones became brittle. They became brittle. Why? His bones cracked, let's say, whatever, they cracked, right? Shoichek heitek heitek, crumbled. Shoichek, when you smash it. Shenischaku atzmosav. Why? Why did his bones get cracked? Shehayah moireh biyado, v'hayah makel gabei mizbeach. Here, he was hitting on the mizbeach and he would say, Lukus, Lukus. At melech vani melech. Boi v'asei imi milchamah. ... Here, lukus, lukus. Yeah, that's, I think they explain, lukus, lukus is the fox. I think it's like a lashon of fox. Lukus, lukus, the Gemara says here. Zeh b'lashon yavan. So why did he call the mizbeach zeh? So the Maharsha explains: the zeh eats the kevasim, it eats up the sheep. The mizbeach, eating up the ... is eating up the mamon Yisrael, swallowing up all the sheep. So he called it lukus, lukus. Yeah. Yeah, so this is also ... Ani melech vani ... right? At melech vani melech. Boi v'asei imi milchamah. Kama shoirim nischatu alecha, kama oves nimlechu alecha, kama ye'evus nischalecha, kama chamorim katru alecha, v'ata hu shemachrives kol ha'olam. You're destroying the world. Yeah, it's your fault. You ever see the people, what do they call them, the health—what do they call that? The naturists, human rights, the animal rights, especially the animal rights activists. This is where it comes from, yeah? Lukus, always lukus, tiny, destroying the world. Look how much oifos and beheimos you're killing, yeah? So therefore, what is he doing?

It's called killout Jewish people. No, but it's possible you see unbelievable things. Boi v'aski l'chamur chamar. He complains against the mizbeach. It's a pasuk in Yirmiyah. He complains against the mizbeach. Look how many oises you're eating. Look how many krotsim. No, but you see unbelievable things. You see that already then they had this human activism, the animal rights, the animal rights. I'm telling you this is what he said. No, he became... Now. Yeah? Yeah. Who? Who became... No, I'm saying he became modern already. He became intelligent. Nice. Harei Ariel, Ariel, ki hachanah davar, ... chagim yinak. Okay, the kidti brings a pasuk. The kid... he brings the pesukim. To make a long story short, he was mecharef and megadef against HaKadosh Baruch Hu. Al tevi'uni regel gaiva, tifros ra'ash. We see clearly that when Titus came into the Beis Hamikdash, he was mecharef and megadef against HaKadosh Baruch Hu. Right? See clearly, right? He walked into the Beis Hamikdash and he started beating up the mizbeach. Yeah? I don't know the history. Akapanim... second, second. Akapanim, what do we have? We have here that there was mecharfei Kel that came into the Beis Hamikdash, right? Good. So again, al bi'as mecharfei Kel, the coming of mecharfei Kel, תוך משכן הדרך, that refers to what, rabosai? Titus, the way they came in and they mecharefed the Ribono Shel Olam. They ridiculed and embarrassed and cursed the Ribono Shel Olam. Mecharfei Kel. But I think be'emes there's more depth of pshat, there's a deeper pshat in mecharfei Kel. Pashut, you're right, there were people that came in that were mecharef HaKadosh Baruch Hu. Be'emes there's deeper than that. It's a very famous Gemara in Avodah Zarah, very famous Gemara in Avodah Zarah. The Gemara speaks about the Beis Hamikdash becoming chol. How did the Beis Hamikdash become chol? The Gemara in Avodah Zarah, daf mem-beis, mem-beis, says like this. The Gemara says like this. Says the Gemara like this. Mizrachis tzfonis. Mizrachis tzfonis, the mizrach side, the mizrach tzfonis. What in English would be west, what, southwest? What's mizrach tzfonis? What's mizrach tzfonis? North. Bekitzur, that's the lishka, the room in the northeast of the Beis Hamikdash, says the Gemara. Ba ganzu beis Chashmonai es avnei hamizbeach. The mizbeach was shattered. The goyim came in and shattered the mizbeach, so they took the mizbeach and they hid it in one of the rooms in the Beis Hamikdash. Which ones? The mizrachis tzfonis ones, the lishka, the rooms in the Beis Hamikdash. The Beis Hamikdash had rooms all around, so they hid over there the avnei hamizbeach. Says the Gemara, what were these avnei hamizbeach? Sheshaktu anshei Yavan. The anshei Yavan smashed them. Anshei... v'amar Rav Sheishes, what's the lashon, sheshaktu? Shaktu is a lashon of sheketz, that they destroyed it, but it's not destruction, churban, but rather sheketz, disgusted. They made it disgusting. Says the Gemara, sheshaktu avdei Avodah Zarah. They broke the stones of the Beis Hamikdash, the mizbeach, to use it for Avodah Zarah. So that's the sheketz. That's how it became sheketz, because they used it for Avodah Zarah. Amar Rav Papa, says Rav Papa, hasam kra askas medaresh. They found the pasuk to bring proof to this yesod, that the mizbeach became chol, became not usable for Beis Hamikdash as soon as the goyim came. Why? Because it says, Uvo bo Plishtim vechililuhu. The Plishtim came in, the goyim came in, and vechilel — they were mechalel, they made chol out of the Beis Hamikdash. So how did they make chol out of the Beis Hamikdash? They smashed the avanim, they smashed the mizbeach, they smashed the klei hakodesh, and they did it for what purpose? To use it for avodah zarah. So now they’re not usable anymore. So therefore, what did the Beis Chashmonai have to do with it? They had to be gonez it. They had to put it away. Says the Gemara. Says the Gemara, Amri, they said, Heichi navid? What can we do? Nitvarinhu? You can’t break them and reuse them. Why? Because avanim shleimos, right? You have to use full stones. So therefore, the only way to get them out of their avodah zarah status would be what? To break it, shinui, make a shinui, break it, and then bring it back to kodesh.

Once it's broken, they can't be used anymore. The Kitzur, ela mai, they should cut it, ... The Kitzur ma'aseh. This is the Gemara that says, the Gemara, ela, so maybe ... they take it for themselves. The Kitzur ma'aseh, this is how they became ... The Gemara is clearly that the avnei mizbeach became ... became chullin because of u'bo bo pritzim vechileluhu. Comes along Rashi, and Rashi says like this: the ksiv u'bo bo pritzim vechileluhu. Very important Rashi. You should not only listen to an important Rashi; it's one of the yesodos, one of the yesodos of the sugya of kodshim in the mizbeach. It's one of the most important Rashis there is. Says Rashi, the ksiv u'bo bo pritzim vechileluhu, mekeivan shenichnesu ovdei kochavim leheichal, the moment the ovdei kochavim came into the heichal, yatzu keilim lechullin. The keilim went into chullin. The keivan denafki lechullin, kinyanu behefkera. So they were koneh behefker. Very interesting Rashi. Pashut pshat is they came in, they destroyed it, and they made a shinui, and the pshat is they did it l'shem avodah zarah, so that's how it became chullin. Rashi doesn't learn that way. Rashi learns that the moment they came in, it became chullin, and once it became chullin, u'bo bo pritzim vechileluhu. The moment they walked in, they ruined it. They walked in. They broke through. The moment there was their entry into the Beis HaMikdash, says Rashi, it was already yatzu lechullin. This is one of the most yesodosdik Rashis. So just think about it. We're going to speak, we're going to speak, we'll speak about everything. We brought this then, that they came in in Eicha, the first pasuk. Eicha says, asher ro... what's the pasuk there again? I'm a little tired. A new pasuk. That you said that they shouldn't come, but it was... Give me the pasuk here, I'm tired, I have to see this. No, no. Asher gro goyim bo mikdasha. So we said that that itself was a chilul. The fact that they came into the Beis HaMikdash, I was quoting this Rashi. That's where I got it from. ... kol machmadeha. Ki rosa goyim ba'u Mikdasha. You saw the goyim that came to the Mikdash. So I said, what's the pshat? Pshat is the actual seeing them coming to the Mikdash already is worth to cry about. Why? Because the Borbo treats them chilulah. I just want to say pshat in the pasuk. Right? It's mashma that they saw. When they saw. And if you saw, what's, it's painful, that's the pshat. Look at them coming to the Beis HaMikdash. No. The moment they saw, they came to the Beis HaMikdash, that itself is Yatzu chilulah. That itself is the moment that the Beis HaMikdash became ois Beis HaMikdash, no more Beis HaMikdash. This is the pshat we want to say in Rashi. So, pshat again. When it says in the, in the, in the Kinnis, Rov goyim, vapius mecharfei El b'soich Mikdash Hadarel. What's the pshat that they're coming? So pashut is because the mecharfei El is the nekudah. The main pain and the main crying is the mecharfei El that's in the Beis Hamikdash. They spoke against the Ribbono Shel Olam. Tzadik, I'm saying it all for you, by the way. In the Kinnis we say, vapius mecharfei El, b'soich Mishkan hadarecha, Mishkan Mikdash Hadarel. So what's the vapius mecharfei El? What is that? What are we crying about, that the charfei El came in inside the Beis Hamikdash? So pashut you could say the main thing is the mecharfei El. The pain is the mecharfei El, not the bi'ah. Who came? These people, the mecharfei El. We brought two rayas that Titus was a mecharef u'megadef. One Gemara says clearly that he was a mecharef u'megadef. Micha, Micha, chasin ka, he was a mecharef u'megadef. And then we bring from Hovos Rav Nosson that he wasn't stam a mecharef u'megadef. In the Beis Hamikdash he was a mecharef u'megadef. He beat up the mizbe'ach, and he started speaking against the Ribbono Shel Olam. He could come and say that the pain is not what, rabosai, the bi'ah, the coming, but who's the who? That he came inside and there he was mecharef u'megadef. Vapius mecharfei El, that he was mecharef the Ribbono Shel Olam where? Within the castle of the king, in the Beis Hamikdash itself. Now we're saying, could he say deeper? It's not the fact that they came, it's the fact that... Now I'll say this, this is Gemara. Now I'll say deeper. The answer is like this. There's a Gemara that says—here, the Gemara says that the Chashmonaim, the Chashmonaim had to go, and take the avanim of the mizbe'ach and hide it; they weren't usable anymore. Says the Gemara, why not? Because... that once they came in and they destroyed the Beis Hamikdash... So the Ruga Morris.

It goes like this. Shachta l'avodah zarah. What they did was they set it up that it should be for avodah zarah, and once it's avodah zarah, it's ba'al to use. Rashi explains it a little bit differently. Rashi doesn't say it that way. Rashi doesn't say that it was avodah zarah mameila can't be used. The opposite. The moment they walked in, then it became chulin. Now that it's, bo bo pirtzim chilul, and some very big—this is a very famous yesod. You have to know this. I mean, anybody knows kashrus knows this is the—this is the sugya. You walk into the Beis HaMikdash, bo bo pirtzim chilul. Says the Gemara, says the Gemara, bo bo pirtzim vechilul. Says the Gemara, says Rashi, then it was yatzu l'chulin, and the keivan denafki l'chulin, then they were able to be koneh b'kinyan. V'havu lehu d'tu, so then it became theirs. V'keivan dishtamshu b'loi l'shem shamayim, and then when they used it for avodah zarah, then it became asur. It's not that they broke it and the breaking for avodah zarah, whatever it is, or the taking for avodah zarah, becomes hefker. So why did it become hefker? Because especially the bo bo pirtzim chilul, it became—becomes chullin. It becomes chullin. It becomes chullin. But if it's considered that it's still avodah zarah, so once it's avodah zarah, then you can't use it anymore. You can't use it because it's chullin. You can't use avodah zarah now. The problem is—without avodah zarah, you'd be able to use it? Yes, so it just turned chullin. Make it over. Right, the same thing. Rashi has to make it that it's there, so otherwise they can't opt for my thing in avodah zarah. So Rashi learns it's a three-step Gemara. They walked in, it became chullin. The moment it became chullin, they were koneh b'hefker, and the moment they were koneh b'hefker, it became avodah zarah, and the moment it becomes avodah zarah, then we can't use it anymore. That's how it works. That's Rashi. The problem is—I don't know if it's a problem—but the emes is this Gemara, Rashi only says לגבי דנקא. Lashon Rashi is— Yatzu Keilav, keilav l'chulin, keilav. Only about the keilim; never spoke about anything else. But his beis, l'churah, wasn't the keilim. No, not pashut. No, I'm saying, so yeah, I mean he's right. I mean, l'churah you could say it's more keili than keilim, keilim. I'm telling you, it's not. It's not keilim, what we think, keilim, pots and pans, right? Probably the muvan is the din keilim. Okay, so, you know, I'll tell you why I'm saying this. Comes along the Ramban, and the Ramban says the Beis HaMikdash itself went l'chulin. Rashi only brings it down in the context of the keilim. The Ramban in the Milchamos is clearly that the whole Beis HaMikdash goes l'chulin. The beis, the moment the bamah permitsa l'chiluluhu, the whole Beis HaMikdash yatzu l'chulin. That's the lashon of the Ramban in the Milchamos when he brings the Gemara. That's one very famous point that everybody speaks about, the Ramban. It's not me, everybody, but the famous Ramban, that it was only the keilim. Rashi's mashma that the keilim. He only speaks more about only the keilim. The Ramban says in this Gemara the whole yatzu Mikdash. He says the Mikdash went l'chulin. That was Rashi using the word yatzu keilav. The Ramban really says yatzu haMikdash. The Mikdash. The Ramban is in the Milchamos in the back. What's chiddush number two in the Ramban? There's one word that Rashi does not say, but the Ramban does say. The Ramban's word is a new milah. Rashi never said this. Rashi just says, bamah pritzas chiluluhu. What happens is it became what? Chol. But he doesn't explain why. He never explained how it turned into chol. The Ramban says it has a new milah. A milah is only by yid, milah, moel b'hekdesh. But first it's moel b'hekdesh, the thing itself becomes chulin. The thing itself becomes chulin, and then you're chayav to pay for the Beis HaMikdash. So the Ramban, there was a gezeiras hakasuv that when the goyim come in, it has a din milah. Milah, moel b'hekdesh. It just coming in. Hagam by us, milah came by just walking into the Beis HaMikdash, bamah pritzas chiluluhu, based on this pasuk. I'm just saying the Ramban, in other words, I'm structuring to you the din of bamah pritzas chiluluhu. Rashi learns it that it pashut l'chulin. Doesn't tell me why. Could be he agrees with the Ramban, he's saying, but— The why and how with which halacha did become chulin, why should it say yatzu l'chulin? We see from the pasuk, yatzu l'chulin. No, Rabbanan... No. That's a chiddush. There's chiddush by them walking in where they don't belong there. They're not supposed to be there, so by them walking in, that itself is a bitul. That's a chiddush. But that's a chiddush of Ramban. Come here. That's the chiddush of Ramban. You see? That's why you have to learn with him. So this is very important. I'm telling you, I wish I could show you how important these two yesodos are from the Rashi and the Ramban, peirush, all the Torah is famous, like one of the most famous sugyas in Shas, Bava Batra. The moment of walking...

into the Beis Hamikdash by the goyim. I don't mean stam, he just walked in there, but he walked in to take over the Beis Hamikdash. The walking in itself causes a tremendous effect on the Beis Hamikdash that it becomes chullin. Rashi doesn't tell me how. Rashi doesn't tell me. Rashi just says, that's what we see from the pasuk, that Ramban sticks it has to do with me'ilah. It has to do with me'ilah. So this is the yesod of a baal ba'aleiim bechilul. What happens is there's a din me'ilah, the me'ilah becomes hekdesh, the me'ilah becomes kodesh, and once it becomes kodesh, it becomes also to us to be used by the Beis Hamikdash. The only chiddush is Rashi says keilim, and the Ramban says Mikdash itself. Okay? Before, there's a major kasha. Why? Major kasha. How could the Ramban learn in the Gemara, ubaal ba'aleiim bechilul? We learned yesterday in the Rambam that are you allowed to be makriv a korban? So the answer is yes. Why? Kedushah rishonah kidshah l'sha'atah, kidshah l'asid lavo. Rashi says baal ba'aleiim bechilul. Make up your mind. What do you mean, what do you mean? They made a chilul. They made a chilul. Look, he's saying the Ramban argues on Ramban, that we pasken that way. Kidshah l'sha'atah, kidshah l'asid lavo is the Gemara. Okay, that's—we're getting to that. Very pashut kasha. How could the Chachamim say that the Beis Hamikdash is kitzlo l'sha'atah, the kitzlo l'asid lavo? Yes, they are showing you the Ramban holds the Beis HaBechirah. Where's the Rambam? You brought it? Did you bring the Rambam? The Rambam in the Beis HaBechirah says clearly that we're makriv korbanos today. Why are we makriv korbanos today? Because kedushah rishonah, kidshah l'sha'atah, kidshah l'asid lavo. Yeah, but this didn't help me. They came and they ruined that kedushah. They came and they destroyed that kedushah. It wasn't to help you. Kidshah rishonah, kidshah l'sha'atah, kidshah l'asid lavo, and therefore you're allowed to be makriv korbanos today. What was that? ... The emes is, the emes is, we have to discuss what is the Beis HaMikdash. Which part is the Beis HaMikdash? When we say Beis HaMikdash, which is the Beis HaMikdash? You know what? Let's talk in simple terms. Is it the house, or is it the place? Is Beis HaMikdash the building? The building? I don't mean the bricks, the building? Or is the Beis HaMikdash the floor, so to speak? The place, so to speak. So there's a very interesting Rambam. Rambam says like this. Huh? Not yet. I don't know yet. I don't know. We'll soon see. Kiddush Rishonah, kitchlah l'sha'atah. Yeah, but we pasken like that all the time. Everybody paskens. We pasken Kiddush Rishonah. I mean, the Rambam, it's a Gemara. So the Rambam has to learn that Gemara. Rambam, how can it even be? No, no, no, I'm saying the Rambam. The Rambam never paskens ... but I mean, how is there a sugya of ... if l'maaseh Kiddush Rishonah, kitchlah l'sha'atah, kitchlah l'asid? Now, perek vav. So the emes is like this. Amram himself, l'churah, is a problem, and I'll explain to you why. So we could come and say like this: you know what? Beis HaMikdash actually could be, isn't the building, which we'll soon see, it's a whole shaila for itself. Beis HaMikdash actually is the makom, is the place itself. Let's see the lashon of the Rambam here. Lefi shekdushas haMikdash v'Yerushalayim mipnei haShechinah, uShechinah einah batelah. Shechinah is einah batelah. V'harei hu omer, v'ashimoti es mikdashechem, I will make shamem, I will make destroyed your Mikdash. V'amru chachamim, chachamim say, af al pi sheshamemim, even though they're shamem, bikdushasan hein omdin. They stand. They stand b'kedusha, meaning, even though the binyan itself is shamei, even though the binyan itself would be called desolate — in English they call it desolate — it still has a din of mikdash. Now here, what is the Rambam referring to? No, the bayis. The bayis is referring to the bayis. No, I'm saying, like, you're missing the point. Let me backtrack a second. You see, my trend of thought is not exactly the way you understand, the way you guys are thinking. I'm trying to understand like this: when the Rambam says, Kedushah rishonah ketzalah l'sha'atah v'ketzalah l'asid lavo, you know what I could come and say? Churah, אי בעו בפריצים וחילולו. We could come and say like this: it's true, ba'u פריצים וחיללוה, but the ground always remains kadosh. That's what you could come and say. The kedushah rishonah...

The kitzur, ... is the ground. Now the problem with that is—I'll explain to you what I have a problem with—is, first of all, the limud that he brings, v'harei hu omer. He brings a proof to Rambam, because it says, V'ashimosi es mikdashechem, and what is it? Even though sheshomemin, bikdushasan hein omdin. Now what's that referring to? Shamem. What is it referring to when it says shamem? It means that the bayis still has a din bayis. It's not that the ground still has—what's the— You're right, it's Rambam, but let's see also Perik Zayin, Halacha Zayin. The Rambam, Perik Zayin, Halacha Zayin says like this: Af al pi shehamikdash hayom charuv b'aveinoseinu, even though today the Mikdash is charuv, chayav adam b'morao, k'mo shehayah noheg bo b'vinyano. Lo yikanes l'makom shemutar likanes l'sham, v'lo yeishev bazarah, v'lo yeikal rosho k'neged shaar mizrach, shene'emar, Es Shabbososai tishmoru u'mikdashi tira'u. Ma shmirah Shabbos l'olam, af mora Mikdash l'olam. Sha'af al pi shecharuv, bikdushaso omed. That even though it's charuv, yeah, bikdushaso omed. One sec, sorry. Af al pi shecharuv, bikdushaso omed. It still stands bikdusha. Which rather held with the raya to the din of Tosfos, that the Rambam's shitah of Tosfos has to do with the Mikdash, because he says that when the Mikdash is up, there's an issur l'hakos rosho min haTosfos. So Tosfos is the Mikdash, according to the Rambam. Anyways, v'hu sheyeh ro'eh es haMikdash, v'lo yegeda mafsik beino uvein haMikdash. Now what's this halacha? Only when the Mikdash is banui, you can't be min haTosfos. You can't have min haTosfos. Masha'ein kein when the Mikdash is not charuv—the Mikdash is charuv—so there's no min haTosfos, but when you're there, there's halacha of mora Mikdash. What's the chiluk? Why is it that way? Let's say I see the makom hamikdash min hachutz. There, there's no halacha. Mashenkein when I come there, there's a halacha of shmiras hamikdash, shmiras meir mikdash. What's the halacha of meir mikdash? Same. So there's a halacha, meir mikdash. What's the halacha? Because it's omed bikdushasoi. Let me tell you what. And then you'll help me sift it out by yourself. You'll help me sift it out. But going through my head is like this. The first problem I have is like this. I have a problem that on one hand it says, v'bo'u bo pritzim vechilleluhu, that by them coming in, they destroyed the kedushas hamikdash. That's what it says, right, according to the Ramban. I turn around, but the Rambam says that kedushah rishonah kidshah l'sha'atah, kidshah l'asid lavo. Yeah, but there was v'bo'u bo pritzim vechilleluhu. L'maaseh, they destroyed it. That's what's bothering me. What's bothering me is how could there be such a halacha? How could there be a halacha of kedushah rishonah kidshah l'sha'atah? L'maaseh, they walked in. Didn't they walk in and destroy the Beis Hamikdash? Didn't they make the Beis Hamikdash? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Then I start wondering like this. We could start splitting and saying like this. You know what? Maybe the Beis Hamikdash, maybe the Beis Hamikdash, the binyan is chol, but the Beis Hamikdash, the karka is still omed bikdushasoi. Why should it be that way? We'll soon see. Why should it be that the v'bo'u bo pritzim vechilleluhu is only for the binyan and not for the thing itself? So let's talk here a minute. We'll talk. But before we get to that, I want to understand if this is true. Is it true that the din of kedushah rishonah kidshah l'sha'atah and kidshah l'asid lavo is on the floor and not the binyan? The emes is, I find two halachos. Here the Rambam tells me. Are you with me, Tzadik? You understand what's bothering me? Simple question. Kedushah rishonah don't let people leave. You see what it is? Fine, and the karka, you have to split it. Okay. Now, is this true? So I'm starting to work with you through the Rishonim to see if this is true. The first thing I show you, that the Rambam himself brings the yesod: Hashimoysi is mikdashchem, v'amru chacham, af al pi shesham mikdashasan hein noymdin. So here we're saying clearly that the mikdash is still teufish, the mikdash. Now what does the mikdash mean? Is the mikdash the binyan? Is the mikdash the karka? I always understood the mikdash is the binyan, and there there's a halacha of what, vashimoysi, that it's still considered bekdushasai, which is a problem, right? The answer obviously has to be that mikdash is not the binyan. Mikdash is the karka. I mean, look, see, again, I'm not doing more than what I'm working with you.

Good. You know what? We'll take it step by step. Step number one is, you're right. There's a halacha binyan, and then there's a halacha karka. Why should it be that way? Gra we spoke yesterday. It's obviously mamish what we spoke yesterday, and that's why I'm telling you today, right? The chiluk between the binyan and the karka, we spoke that yesterday, and we'll be mamshich a little bit later to explain it. B, we have to understand, l'maaseh, how could it be that bo bo pritzu khulu was on one thing and not the other? But first of all, is that true? Are we saying a true thing? So the first thing we have to say is, look at the Rambam. The Rambam brings a pasuk, v'asu li mikdash. What does mikdash mean? That's the Beis HaMikdash, right? You know, we use the same halacha לגבי בתי כנסיות, you know? Now that's not the floor of the batei knessios, and that's why, that's what I'm telling you. Pasuk sham, mikdashim is the mikdash itself, the binyan. Sometimes we have to say, no, it's not, right? We have to say, even though we learn out batei knessios from it, but it just means v'asu li mikdash, the floor. Now, l'maaseh, the Rambam is a problem for me, and I'll tell you what my problem with the Rambam is. Two things. Why does the Rambam need another pasuk l'gabei the me'orer mikdash? The Rambam says, how do I know you have to have me'orer from the Mikdash today? He says because shmiras Shabbos, just like Shabbos is l'olam the mikdash, why don't you just use the old pasuk? Why don't you just use it? Kedushah she'kidsha l'sha'atah v'kidsha l'asid lavo. So you don't need another pasuk from Shabbos, just like Shabbos l'olam. That's the first problem I have. You hear my question? Kasha. Unless you learn, and this we practically spoke, touched on yesterday, the din of me'aremikdash is not from the floor, it's from the bayis. So I would say if the bayis is not there, maybe there's no halacha of me'aremikdash. The hainu, it's true, lashimais mikdashim is the floor. That's the floor. Now you want to know the din me'aremikdash. The din me'aremikdash is talui in the bayis, in the binyan. So he's trying to say another halacha, that me'aremikdash remains l'olam. The problem is, af al pi shecharav, shas yaima, but it's not true. Bamah pritzim chililu. That's my problem, okay? So in other words, that's what was going through my head ten minutes ago, but I wasn't being able to bring it to l'maaseh, but that's what was going through my head. This cheshbon is going through my head. So then it's the same thing, so we're back to the original kasha. Unless you learn, unless you learn, it's not the chiddush. There's a chiluk between charev and Bamah pritzim chililu. Charev means that the bayis is just not there; it's broken. But eina chanami, once the pritzim came, and on that there's a halacha b'kedushas hayomed. On that there's a halacha b'kedushas hayomed. If there's no binyan, you still have it. But if the chilul, the prutzim came before, but if the prutzim takkeh come, chilul. Either I'm saying kedushah rishonah kidshah l'shaatah v'lo kidshah l'asid lavo. I would say that's on the floor. That's on the floor, l'maaseh. In other words, what remains from the kedushah rishonah kidshah l'shaatah, so technically without the Bamah pritzim chililu, what would be is— I can't tell, because you're saying no. No, no. No, I'm saying without the Bamah pritzim chililu would be b'kedushas hataino. But what do you see that from the Zohar? No, I'm telling you, why is the din me'aremikdash today? Could be that's without the Bamah pritzim chililu. Don't be— You understand the halacha. L'maaseh today. You know, l'maaseh, why is it— Let me say, I know it's a— that's l'olam. Get into Torah, know one day it will be Bamah pritzim chililu. That's your kasha, right? No, stop. No, you're— just poshut now. Just poshut now there's a din me'aremikdash. I don't know. Again, I'm working it out with you. Unless you say that the eina chanami, the din me'aremikdash is the binyan. Bamah pritzim chililu today, meaning l'maaseh took care of the problem of the binyan because they destroyed the binyan, they destroyed the kedushah bayis. Chorv is one thing. Chorv means it's destroyed. But eino chanami, when you mevatel it, when you make it hefker, maybe eino chanami. Eino chanami, taki yatzu mikdushasoi, which would maybe chiddush. That's the cheshbones that go through my head. And another problem I have in halacha—the whole halacha doesn't make sense. What's the reason why kedushah rishonah kidshah l'sha'atah v'kidshah l'asid lavo is me'ah Shechinah and not Shechinah? And a teivah—what's the kedushas habayis? It's the same reason. It's me'ah Shechinah, Shechinah v'teivah. The reason—Rambam says it's svara. Lefi sheha-kedushah mikdash Yerushalayim me'ah Shechinah v'shechinah v'teivah. He even talks about Yerushalayim, he talks about that. So what, the kedushas habayis is not with Shechinah? The kedushas habayis also vayter with Shechinah. The kedushas habayis also me'ah Shechinah. Yeah? That's the churah of the kasha. You got the kasha? Again, between the bayis and the floor. What do you mean? Bayis is the floor, but the Rambam brings vashmoichs midaschem, matzmanes hamikdash, and we learn out Beis HaKnesses from that. דין in the floor, it's a din in the house.

Eretzis, af al pi kein, make this to the floor, okay. So how come the Rambam needs another halacha by Me'orei Mikdash? The Me'orei Mikdash, the Rambam says this whole din of Me'orei Mikdash is mana zeh because it's Shabbos. It's just Shabbos, ... Why'd you just say, למה הייתי צריך? Kodesh ... Teretz is, Me'orei Mikdash didn't in the Bayis. Me'orei Mikdash didn't in the Bayis. We don't have a Bayis, so you would say that therefore there's no din of Me'orei Mikdash this mana zeh. Kamashma lan, af al pi kein Shabbos. יפה. Beautiful. Problem is, the problem is, first of all, what's the whole reason? What's the whole reason why there's a halacha of the kiddush ... kitzur ... because the Shechinah. So then there's no ספק between the floor and the keilim and the Bayis. ... No, I'm saying, so maybe you have to— Rambam is about Yerushalayim. ... No, no, I told you there's no between. Yeah, but how did the Bayis become kadosh? Because the ... What's the kedushah of the Bayis? ... What's the kedushah of ...? That's what I'm telling you. You can't give my teretz. What's my whole teretz? ... works only on the Bayis, and it doesn't work on the karka. No, because makom, the makom. I'm asking you, but why doesn't it work on the makom? Because it's ... ... Rambam gives me a reason. ... it's the same kedushah. Why? Why? He's saying, ... you have to fix up what you're saying, and you realize what you're saying. In other words, if you chap what you were saying, you realize you're saying very good. And you said two words, and you're on the right track. You're saying very good. Well, ... and I got it from the ... panel. Well, ... Now, why am I saying all this? Because the emes is, I have another raya. What's my other raya? The Rambam is a very interesting Rambam. What's called Beis HaMikdash, and when is it called Beis HaBechirah? You have to realize, mitzvos say, La'asos bayis laShem, mukhan lihyos makrivin bo korbanos, right? Korbanos. Then the Rambam says like this: but you have to build a bayis laShem. You have to build a bayis laShem. What pasuk does he bring? V'asu li mikdash. Contrast. Take a look at the Rambam Hilchos Melachim. Shalosh mitzvos nitztavu Yisrael b'shaas knisasan la'aretz. Three mitzvos that the Rambam, they had to do when they came into Eretz Yisrael: limnos lahem melech, l'hachris zera Amalek, shene'emar timcheh es zecher Amalek, ulivnos Beis HaBechirah, shene'emar l'shichno tidrashu uvasa shamah. You have to go and go to the shechinah. You got to go to the neighborhood of the Ribbono Shel Olam and search the Ribbono Shel Olam. Therefore you have to build the Mishkan, the Beis HaMikdash. Al hachurah there's a problem over here. Why over here does the Rambam bring the pasuk, V'asu li mikdash v'shachanti b'socham, and here when the Rambam speaks about building a Mishkan, when you come into Eretz Yisrael, he brings a different pasuk, L'shichno tidrashu uvasa shamah. What's the pshat? I'm ready to ask. I'm ready to tell you who asked the kasha if you're interested. The Lechem Mishneh asked the kasha. Lechem Mishneh good enough for you? Lechem Mishneh. Here, Lechem Mishneh. Kasha. The Lechem Mishneh, Beis HaBechirah, kasav, ein matzinu la'asos bayis laShem, v'asu li mikdash. Good enough question for you? Okay, now I'll tell you what I think the pshat in the world is. Here the Rambam talks about korbanos, Bayis Hashem, makrivim by korbanos. Notice that the Rambam calls it Beis HaMikdash, ma'is. Here the Rambam calls it Beis HaBechirah, Livnos Beis HaBechirah. Why didn't you say Beis HaMikdash? It's a subtle loss here. Since the Rambam calls Hilchos Beis HaBechirah in the halachic, but in the watcher quote, when he brings the mitzvah, ma'is, smucha laShem, makrivim bo korbanos. And here he says what? Livnos Beis HaMikdash, Livnos Beis HaMikdash. The asuli Mikdash, asuli Mikdash, Beis HaMikdash, bayis Beis HaMikdash. Here he calls it Beis HaBechirah, and he brings the pasuk, Leshichno tidrishu u'vasa shamah. Now I'll tell you, either this is mine, or I heard this years ago from other people, or other mefarshim, other sefarim. I didn't have time to look up where I got it. But this is in my head and I know it. This is Torah from way back when. So believe me, I worked on it. It's been worked on. It's just I don't remember now if it's my own vort or I saw it somewhere, meaning I saw it in some other... Could be it's an open...

It's open somewhere. It could be often a place in Vegas somewhere. I don't have enough time to check into it, but it's the famous. I don't book. It doesn't bother me to say it over the way it is. There's two dinim. There's din Beis Hamikdash, we gotta be korbanos, and that's called Beis Hamikdash. We can bring our korbanos. Then there's bayis, which the bayis is called Beis Habchirah, and that's called, v'shachanti b'socham. Beis Hamikdash has two things. There's korbanos, and remember I explained to you, for korbanos you don't need the bayis, for usuli Mikdash. Don't say bayis, it says usuli Mikdash. The floor is the Mikdash. Gerazah, the floor is a condition that you need the special halacha that you have to put a house around the floor to make the floor part of the bayis. Yeah, but the pshat is it's the floor. The floor is the Beis Hamikdash. If you want to know what the Beis Hamikdash is, it's the floor. Slowly, slowly, again, there's such a thing called Beis Hamikdash. There it's v'asu li Mikdash. Mikdash is a makom kadosh, that's what Mikdash is. Mikdash is a makom kadosh. The bayis encloses, makes the makom that this is miyuchad l'kodesh, but it's the makom. When we talk about Beis Hamikdash, it's not the house, it's the place. For example, when you live in a house, tell me, do you live — and this is a very famous question — do you live in the home, or do you live within this enclosure of the four walls? Where are you living exactly? Both. That's true. Let me understand, my lamdus is true. I mean, when it is, when you — I mean, you're living in a house. Or you're living here, and the only way to live here is when you have walls around it because it's enclosed. But it's true, it's not a wall, it's a floor. It means the floor, right? With this, I'd rather want to speak to you about something. Tell me, is there a halacha of floor in a sukkah? No. I'm just רוצה get... You mean, the halacha of roof in a sukkah. What's a sukkah? The... Okay, so I'm just throwing this out just to think about it. Beis dira. Over there, is there a floor? I just want to... It would be on the air. Is it the sukkah, the walls, or the sukkah, the enclosure? Tell me something. You don't remember this Torah? This is the same as the previous Torah. No, by sukkah you don't remember this Torah? Yeah, but they talk about this Torah. You know what I'm talking about. Is there a din karka regarding the walls? The walls. Yeah, I'm saying, no, I understand. There's no din karka really in the sukkah, l'chaira not. I'm just throwing this out just so you should understand what I'm talking about. Bayis is the enclosure, or bayis is the whole bayis, the house, all right? So it's the enclosure, right? Okay, now, here, let's talk for a minute. Ready? Ready? Okay, I don't want to get into the houses and not houses. I think it's self-understood. Either it's the home, or it's the enclosure within the home, okay? Beis hamikdash is the enclosure within. That's the Beis Hamikdash. Tzad is it's a makom kadosh, and the tnai in that is bayis. Bayis encloses the makom. That's another thing, din bayis that we spoke yesterday. Besides that, there's also din bayis. That in bayis, says the Rambam, that in bayis is beis habechirah, a halacha to make a special home for the Rabbeinu Shlolem, beis habechirah. The din is a halacha l'shichnasi sidr shehu basa Shamayim; you got to go to the Rabbeinu Shlolem's house. It's not korban; that's to come to the house of the Rabbeinu Shlolem. That's l'shichnasi sidr shehu basa Shamayim. There's a different din. There's one din halacha. I know, and hagahah, the Rambam brings aliyah laregel over here. The Rambam brings down aliyah too. The Rambam says that there's a din that you have to be oleh regel, chagim eilu shalosh pa'amim bashanah. I understand that, but that's a din in oleh regel, and then there's a special halacha of l'shichnasi sidr shehu basa Shamayim. There's a special halacha of l'shichnasi sidr, because it's not oleh regel. L'shichnasi sidr is not in the parsha of oleh regel. Yesh lefalel b'chol zeh. You understand what I want. What I want to say is that obviously, if you look closely in the Rishonim, there's a chiluk between the place and the bayis. The chiluk is the place and the bayis. There's a chiluk, there's a din between the place and the bayis. You should know, ... clearly, that the Rambam brings two mekoros, two different pesukim for Beis HaMikdash. So b'hechrech the pshat...

It has to be, one is makom, and one is what? The bayis. Beis habechirah is called the mikdash, yeah, the mikdash, the korbanos, the avodah. And you see, because today you mach of korbanos even in the bayis. No. I don't know. I don't know. I'll pay the two ... otherwise. Work on it, work on it. I'm not, I'm not. I'm just saying it's interesting that the Rambam, all I'm trying to say is the Rambam says Beis Hamikdash, Beis Habechirah. The Rambam gives two different pesukim. And l'chorah we could say, and I have other raayos, but also that's not for now, there's two dinim in the Beis Hamikdash. There's the bayis, and the truth is, we spoke about this yesterday, the hainu, min hatzofim is which halachah? Is the bayis. That's exactly what I try to tell you. What I try to say yesterday, this yesod: there's two dinim. There's one din of bechirah on the bayis, and there's one din bechirah on the mikdash, on the makom hamikdash, on the korbanos bheichal. That's why I understand why the Rambam has to give another pasuk of af al pi, even though they're charuv, they're still kadosh. So what do you need another pasuk for? Me'ir Mikdash, the Torah says Me'ir Mikdash is telling the bayis. And today we don't have the bayis. Today we don't have the bayis anymore. Because we don't have the bayis anymore, still you can't use that pasuk. That's why you have to have a special pasuk for shmiras Shabbos. Also, shmiras Shabbos... Why do we make this remain? Why is it that metzora only when? Only b'zman shehu banui. What's the pshat? The Rambam says like this: b'zman shehaMikdash banui, asur l'ladam l'hakos rosho מן הצרפתים... Why? Because... Yer'ei es haMikdash. Mamash, if you yarei es haMikdash, and you're not allowed to be meikil rosho when you're there, because halacha, you're not allowed to be meikil rosho when you're there. And you're not allowed to be meikil rosho when you're there even though it's not banui. So even if you're min haTzofim and you see it, you should have the same halacha. What's the pshat? B'zman shehaMikdash banui, I thought you just—this opposite—Mikdash charev, there's no halacha, me'ikar din. Ela mai, you come and say you don't see it. If you do see it, the case is you see it. What's the teretz? Teretz is, the etzem מצד ההלכה... in the bayis. So if it's not banui, there's no halacha of min haTzofim. There's a special halacha of shmiras Shabbos, but that's only when you're there. That new halacha, that's a new halacha. This new halacha of Tzofim, this... that the chiddush of it is af al pi she'ein haBayis banui, if when you're there. Could be the pshat is, could be the pshat is, could be the pshat is, Mikdashi tiro'u, because there's a din korbanos there, there's a din kedushah there. But in the din bayis, which mechayev the din me'orer Mikdash, min haTzofim you don't have it. It's not there. You see, you have two reasons. Two reasons for the... Right. One is the din of the bayis, and one is the din of the me'orer Mikdash. Dr. Rambam maybe chiddush: it would be a din in the me'orer Mikdash, so then you know what I would come and say? Now that we don't have a bayis, you don't have it anymore. That's why I don't want to use this pasuk, Dr. Rambam. What do I use? Tzofim... Therefore I'm going to split it and say, min haTzofim, where I don't see the bayis. But once I'm here, the heichal... Like the Gemara l'veir, the after they finished from the tzroifim, they came there, they tried to ... themselves. That's me'arei mikdash of this matter. That's the pshat, huh? Again. No, that's not pshat. I'm telling you, it's just a matter of learning. Only with the bias. ... halacha is bias, because ... is bias. There's a naya chiddush that even though there's no bias, mikdash ikrio. Special mikdash ikrio. Why? What's that? That could be this halacha pshat. Then we go back to halacha, because the makom haMikdash is ... choice. So when you're there, and a kohen, there's halacha of mikdash ikrio. From which pasuk? That's what I'm trying to tell you. From this pasuk we have that the Mikdash is kaiyam. The kedushas haMikdash is kaiyam. But you don't know that the din ... mikdash is telling that. You would say ... in the bayis. You don't know that. You come and say, you know what? The Mikdash is kadosh. That's true. I, when I come there, there's a kedushah. Let's have fear from that. Who says the fear is min haMikdash, but rather min habayis haMikdash, from the bayis? So mashma in the pasuk that even though there's no bayis, still there's a din of ... mikdash. So what is that din of ... mikdash? Min haMikdash, not min habayis. So ... that you're not by the bayis, the binyan. So if you see the binyan, fine. If you don't see the binyan, there's no ... mikdash. That's the pshat. Halacha obviously splits the bayis from the makom. That's what I'm telling you. Halacha obviously splits the bayis from the makom.

The din ma'ar mikdash for the bayis, that's ... that if you see good, if you don't, there's nothing there. Then there's a ... cross. That's the pasuk. ... That's ... that's ... Then that's ... Al temitah shebayis, you have a special din ma'ar, that's there. That's ... shegiya lheichal. When you get to the heichal, there's a din ma'ar mikdash. When you come there, there's a din ma'ar mikdash. Mimeila, so we've established that ein hachanami, there's a chiluk between the bayis and there's a chiluk between the makom haheichal. And this is mamash what we spoke yesterday. Al zeh haya ... aleinu, the klurah ... that there's two problems: there's the bayis and there's the heichal. See, now I can go back to the ... Bovo pischa shel chilulu. This is in the bayis. Bovo pischa shel chilulu is not in the karka. This דין of mikdash, that's not a ... Now, you have to ... All right, okay. No, the ... mikdash, but the ... mikdash is the bayis. Mikdash. And a Chanami, mikdash, the bayis, that's a Bovo pischa shel chilulu. So I'm talking about the karka being regarding the korbanos. ... shchitah, ... kitzur, ... the karka. You have the way we spoke yesterday. ... What is the bayis? Is that ... and the bayis, or ... the bayis? The Bovo pischa shel chilulu is in the beginning of bayis. ... We don't have the bayis anymore. Everything's beautiful. ... That's ... on two things: the makom and the bayis. Which thing? Which thing? ... Right, so beis habechirah is the bayis. We don't have that. And this is in the makom. Now we have a mikdash. ... Yeah. What? What? What? What? I'm getting to that. Hold on. In other words, I want to differentiate between the bayis and the karka. So now you can ask me a kasha like this: What's taka pshat, the chiluk between the bayis and the karka? ... my original kasha: shchinah ... So then the Shechinah never ... So then the Shechinah goes on both, goes on the bayis, and it goes on the binyan also. ... I mean, if it's karka remains ... the Shechinah ... so this also is Shechinah. What's the difference? You know, the teretz is very poshut, poshut teretz. Rashi doesn't tell me how the Bovo pischa shel chilulu works, but the Ramban does. The Gemara says it works with just mi'ut. Halacha is ein mi'ut b'karka. Karka, there's no mi'ut. Why? Because karka is ein nigzeles. Karka is ein nigzeles. That's the mi'ut. Mi'ut gezeilah, ein mi'ut b'karka. That's the din mi'ut. You're stealing it. No, but it's not the... they gave it a din mi'ut, but there's no mi'ut on karka. Yeah, but... So the moment they broke it, that's what the Gemara says. The moment they broke it, that's... both things are true. It's true that the moment they came in, it went l'chulin. Yeah, but l'maaseh there's no mi'ut b'karka. The pshat is they had to break it. Once they broke it, even the ba'alus became nigzal. Once the ba'alus becomes nigzal, sharafa l'maaseh. Maran Panos, siman nun hei, says this. The pshat is that, tzad tzad, karka ein nigzeles, no mi'ut by karka. So once there's no mi'ut by karka, the whole thing is based on the mi'ut; there's no mi'ut by karka. So therefore that's the chiluk. The ba'alus itself, bobo pritzu l'chilul, we don't have a ba'alus. We don't have a beis habechirah today. Maran Panos, siman nun hei. Oh, really? That's the pshat. Yeah. That's pshat. ... The Gemara speaks about them breaking it. Peirus. The moment they broke it, so then it's not the karka anymore. Once it's not the karka, so then the ba'alus became bobo pritzu l'chilul. Masheinkin the karka itself, d'hainu the makom hamikdash, there's no way to undo the makom hamikdash. There's no mi'ut on the makom hamikdash. Therefore the... like you said yesterday, there's two yesodos in Beis Hamikdash. There's ba'alus, ba'alus hamakom, and there's the makom. Beis Hamikdash is מצד המקום, beis Hamikdash is מצד הבעלות. There's the chiluk between l'gabei both halachos. That was... avadai it was both. That's bobo pritzu l'chilul. They came and ruined the ba'alus hamikdash. That's what they ruined. Karka ein nigzeles. Huh? Huh? So I'm telling you, because that's when the karka... that's when the karka. I asked you why should I split it? That's my pshat. Because the whole thing is based on mi'ut; mi'ut, so there's no mi'ut on karka. Ein mi'ut on karka, so don't say mi'ut on karka.

That's what. It was kind of a club. It was of gezeirah d'Chacham. Yeah, if he's a gezeirah. It's a talacha. Karka nigzeles b'kesef. And it's not karka, it's not nigzeל, but it was different. That's what you think. More knowledge. The Gemara says, Ein milah b'karkais, because ein karkais nigzeלות b'karka. Talachah. So it's not gezeilah, it's not. The... I want to wish you all a wonderful summer. I want to wish you a wonderful summer. Huh? Tav-kuf nun aleph. Tav-kuf nun aleph. Ah. Shmatishteh. Today, I want to go back to something we spoke yesterday, the day before. The Rambam that we were... Bring me the Rambam, please. No, when the Rambam says Hilchos Taanis—again, we need the wrong Rambam—the Rambam Hilchos Taanis. The Rambam says that there are five things that happen on Tisha B'Av, right? Perek ה, halacha ג'. B'Tisha B'Av, chamishah devarim ra'im nikre'u l'Yisrael: nigzar al Yisrael b'midbar shelo yikhnesu l'aretz, charav haBayis, nikb'ah ir gedolah... And then it says, U'vo'i b'yom hamuchlaf l'peranius, tursnusfuros harasha, hee hee, u'vchorban haHeichal. So we asked, we asked in previous shiurim, why does the Rambam have to say, U'vo'i b'yom hamuchlaf l'peranius? Only on the last thing. He should start off the Rambam on that day. Start the whole din on that day, which is muchlaf l'peranius. These five things happened. Why does he... Why does the Rambam tell me, fakert? The Rambam tells me the opposite. First he tells me four things happened, and then he starts off with the U'vo'i b'yom hamuchlaf l'peranius, this, this fifth thing happened. Same question is the question we asked. We said a very nice pshat in the Gemara, that that's how we know it happened that day. The Rambam is explaining to you how we know that this thing happened. How are we to know that it happened on Tisha B'Av? There's no raya for that, but it's U'vo'i b'yom hamuchlaf l'peranius this happened. The Rambam is telling you how we know and how we understand that it happened that day. That's how we learn the pshat in the Rambam. I think there's also another nekudah here in the Rambam. Besides this, in other words, this is also emes, that the bai b'yom hamuchlach l'pranius, is already the proof, it's already the marmakim that we know that it happened on Tisha B'Av. I think also there's a little bit plus, a hosafah to this, another nekudah here in the Rambam. I'll tell you what I think it is. The Tur brings down, Tisha B'Av ein beis din yecholin levatel. Tisha B'Av can never become a batel, can never become a batel Tisha B'Av. Why? Hoil shehuchpalu bo tzaros. Since there were many tzaros. The hainu, let's say a certain dor will arrive that Eretz Yisrael won't have it so bad, and the beis din will want to come and be mevatel Tisha B'Av. States the Tur, Tisha B'Av ein beis din yecholin levatel. Beis din won't be able to be mevatel. No, no, I'm saying that's when Mashiach comes. Say right now, as of now, before Mashiach comes, states the Tur that beis din won't be able to be mevatel Tisha B'Av. No beis din can be mevatel. Says the Beis Yosef, peri kama d'Rosh Hashanah. This comes from a peri kama d'Rosh Hashanah. V'kasavti b'siman shekodem zeh, and I spoke about this in the previous siman. Now, back to Beis Yosef, I'm ready to get kashya. What's the reason ein beis din yachol levatloi? Because huchpalah b'itzares. Shevasah b'ta'anis is mashma that you could be mevatel. Beis din warns, because mashma only tzibbur. I tookfulei b'itzares. The fact that... Because... So therefore, even if beis din feels that they want to be mevatel, they can't be mevatel. They can't. Huchpalah b'itzares, if it's already established as a... That's Tisha B'Av. If you want to be mevatel Tisha B'Av, you can't do it, because it's huchpalah b'itzares. Zogt the Beis Yosef, yeah, but so what do you do with shevasah? It's also huchpalah b'itzares, and it's mashma only Tisha B'Av. Everything else you could be mevatel. Zogt the Beis Yosef, kratirsa taanis. Tosafos already gives this as a teretz, and he gives two teirutzim. I'll show you the significance of both teirutzim. Zogt Tosafos, teretz number one: the churban Beis HaMikdash k'fi for Tisha B'Av. Tisha B'Av, Tisha B'Av is k'fi for... It has to ask churban habayis. You can't compare it to shevasah b'ta'anis. The problem with this is, but that's not what the Tur says. The Tur gives the reason...

What's the pshat that it's kefi tuvah? Unless he means huchpel in measurement, that's what he means. It doesn't mean huchpel how many tzaros, but huchpel means that b'steichusav, it's much more. It's kefi tuvah; it's not basar neturah that way, right? Again, as I'm telling you, the Tosafos teretz, do me a favor, we have to establish a yesod. If I ask you a kasha on the Tur, the Gemara uses the same lashon, I understand, so it's a kasha on the Gemara, and I understand, but it doesn't bother me. I mean, good, it's a kasha on the Gemara, okay, good, I'm sorry. Okay, רבי לוי wants you to know that it's not a kasha only on the Tur, but it's a kasha on the lashon of the Gemara that the Tur is bringing. Okay. Okay. Things like this: the lashon of the Tur, Rabbi Weiss points out correctly, is the lashon of the Gemara. The problem is, it says huchpel b'oi tzaros. So therefore, shevaot were also huchpel, you have to be metaher, so why? Because this is kefi tuvah, but that's not what the lashon of huchpel b'tzaros means. The Gemara gives different reasons. The Gemara gives the reason because huchpel b'tzaros. Huchpel means many things happened that day. Because of many things that happened that day, so how could Tosafos give a teretz because the churban habayis is worse? So let him just say, tisha b'Av you can't be mevatel because it's worse, not because huchpel b'tzaros. Unless huchpel b'tzaros, you have to say, means huchpel doesn't mean an event, but huchpel means that b'seneichus, but that's not the lashon of the Gemara. The lashon of the Gemara is huchpel, many things happened. Then Tosafos v'od gives another teretz. I mean, here the kasha is a pashut kasha, right? Peshita, huchta boy tzaris. Like Taisis, why he shivah? Yeah, because the chumra bais is worse. Yeah, but that's not what the Gemara says. The Gemara says huchta boy tzaris. Okay. Right, another pshat says Taisis, loy dami l'tisha b'Av. It's not domeh to Tisha B'Av. The tzarah achas huchta boy. The same tzarah happened twice. The same tzarah happened twice. Aval hacha the kasha is, so what? What does it mean? What does Taisis mean? If you come and say many bad things happened that day, so you could come and say, I hear tons of many bad things. Okay, so when it's not huchta boy tzaris, so therefore we can be mevatel, it's less. But if the huchta boy tzaris means what? Huchta boy, the same thing happened twice. So meileh what? Meileh what? That's why it's so worse. That's why today— No, what do you mean, why? Let's say five different things—yeah, but if five different things happened, or the same thing happens twice, it's the same thing. What's the difference if you have 24 or two times 12? No, because you have it again and again. It's not one day you have— Let me ask you, what's the difference if you have 12 dollar bills or two—if you have one ten or two fives? What's the difference? What's worse? What's better? Is there a difference between a ten dollar bill, ten singles, or two fives? Two papers more. Same thing. It's huchta boy. It's good, you have two of the same. What's the difference? It's over and over again. It can happen again and again. I'm telling you, so what's the difference if you have this tzarah twice or you have five different things that happened that day? This day is a terrible day, no? No, if it happened again, it doesn't include, because it happened again already. So it happened once, now again it happened. Meileh what? So why is it worse? That's what Taisis says, it's a special day. Yeah, but why is it worse? Why is it worse if five other things happened? Because, okay, one day—no big deal. But if you say exact—I'm saying, if you say it happened again and again. I mean, l'maaseh, chumra b'tzaros. Chumra b'tzaros means the same tzarah happened twice. I understand, but l'maaseh, between me and you, it's not a chumra. So what? So let's say the chumra bayis. Let me ask you a question. If there was supposed to be— What's the difference then? The day. The day. If five terrible things have to happen, and all five happen the same day, forget it, it's the same chumra. What's the difference? If you tell me it's the tzarah, so you can come and say this is a bigger tzarah because the same thing happened twice. But if you tell me this day is mukhlah l'peranius, from the pshat that this day is mukhlah l'peranius, if five different occurrences all happened on that day, it's also the same thing. It's a stickle—it's tzarich עיון here. Why is— I mean, I hear what you're saying. I agree with you. I'm trying to understand, is it so glatt? Is it so true that the Rambam says, u'vayom hamukhlah l'peranius, he says only on the fifth thing, v'lachein, what happened to the other four? It's also yom mukhlah l'peranius. So he wants to say like this: Tisha B'Av ein bo zecher l'vatalah. Tisha B'Av doesn't came l'vatalah. Kilu sheruchtzu... You'll see more why the Rambam said it. We'll soon see. So it says like this: Kilu sheruchtzu l'atzaros, so therefore you can't be mevatel ever Tisha B'Av. Tisha B'Av you can't be mevatel. The emes is the Beis Yosef brings down Tosafos...

And says, V'chai hochlu tashmish v'asa, also huchlu eitzaros. Aki ki mevatel shiv'asa, bizman hazeh, if they beisin decide to do it, hai l'maaseh have a problem; it's huchlu eitzaros. ... We'll see, it's another kasha. That's a Tosafos also, we'll speak about it. So the kitzur, the kasha is, v'im teimar, shiv'asa b'tameis also huchlu eitzaros. Says Tosafos two terutzim. Tosafos number one: Churban Beis Hamikdash, tekufah. Tisha B'Av from Churban Habayis. Churban Habayis is much worse, and once something is much worse, mimeila therefore you came and mevatel. V'chein hachanami, shiv'asa b'tameis. Again, a lot of things happened; you can still be mevatel. We asked l'chura, but that's not the taamei the Gemara. The Gemara says huchlu eitzaros. Let the Gemara come and say, kefifah. Don't say huchlu; you gave the wrong reason. It says huchlu eitzaros. You question shiv'asa, also huchlu eitzaros. Teretz is lost. No, Beis Hamikdash tekufah. That's not what the Gemara said. The Gemara says huchlu eitzaros. Okay, that's not a kasha. Good. Then Tosafos says, v'oid, lo dami, and this all the Beis Yosef brings down, v'oid lo dami l'Tisha B'Av. The tzarah achas huchlu boi; different, because by Tisha B'Av the same tzarah happened twice. In itself was huchlu boi. The Beis Hamikdash was nechrav one, two, twice. Mimeila therefore Tisha B'Av is worse. That's not a kasha; why does it make it worse? If you have five terrible things happen, or you have one terrible thing happening twice, it's the same thing. What's the difference? Okay, but for some reason it's different. That's the ... Now, if you take a look, there's a very interesting Gemara in Megillah. Gemara Megillah says that Rebbe, bimei Rebbe bikshu l'hafsik Tisha B'Av. They tried to knock out Tisha B'Av. ... I'm going to get to Rosh Hashanah, I'm going to get to ... Talmid. ... Everybody pays over here. The maaris is like this. U'vikesh lakatishbo. Maybe he wanted to stop Tisha B'Av, but ... chachamim said not to do it, not to. Because it was a zman that it was okay; there was less tzaar. Oh, so that's Tosafos. That's Tosafos. Tosafos: Tisha B'Av ... kashya. Heichi salka daitach, datana, hayeit lakatishbo legamrei? How could you be wanting to be meikil Tisha B'Av legamrei? The hainu Tosafos is learning originally they wanted to get rid of it completely. V'amrina, kol oichel v'shoseh b'Tisha B'Av, eino ro'eh b'nechamah. So you won't be zocheh to nechamah, so how could you be meikil legamrei? Originally happened already. So that's, I don't understand Tosafos. Maybe the only time, if you eat on Tisha B'Av, you won't be zocheh to ... when you have a Tisha B'Av. I think Tisha B'Av already happened. Yeah, Tisha B'Av already happened. You can't erase what happened. Yeah, so there's no do with this taam. What's the raya of Tosafos? Tosafos means a raya, because whoever comes and eats on Tisha B'Av, eino ro'eh b'nechamah. Yeah, but maybe if there's a Tisha B'Av, if there's a Tisha B'Av, eino ro'eh b'nechamah. So that's another kasha I don't understand. Who says it's the only way to be misabel on Yerushalayim is to fast on Tisha B'Av? Maybe the Gemara's taam means. I mean, what the Gemara's saying, kol oichel v'shoseh b'Tisha B'Av ... So what's his kasha? Kol oichel, whoever eats on Tisha B'Av, yeah, that's when there's a taanis. Yeah, but if there's no taanis, you could be ... eino ro'eh b'nechamah. Are you going to come and say that sof sof you have to be misabel on Yerushalayim? Of course you'll do it another way. Again, we understand you have to be misabel on Yerushalayim, right? Good, you'll have to be misabel on Yerushalayim. So you'll be oiker the taanis, but at the same time you'll be misabel other ways, make tikun chatzos. I mean, I don't know what Tosafos wanted exactly. It was like this: the din of the taanis. Maybe the whole din of taanis is like this: kol hoychel b’shayta, means you don’t keep Tisha B’Av. So the only problem is if there’s a Tisha B’Av. One second, who says that when you’re osek Tisha B’Av it’s not there totally? That’s what I’m asking you. I don’t know. Regarding the inyan in the... that’s my kasha. That’s my kasha. That’s what I’m asking you. I’m asking the Tosafos first kasha. Tosafos, how can you come and say you can’t... you don’t fast on Tisha B’Av? I learned that there’s something there in the day. Your kasha was on Tosafos. The Gemara says like this: kol hoychel b’shayta b’Tisha B’Av, so l’maaseh you see you have to be me’aneh on Tisha B’Av. Yeah, you only have to fast on Tisha B’Av if there’s a Tisha B’Av. That’s your kasha, right? So my kasha, I’m trying to answer this kasha. Yeah. I’m trying to say this: who says that when there’s no Tisha B’Av, totally, the day has no... no mahus of Tisha B’Av? Maybe the day has, just you don’t have to do any of the... you don’t have to fast. So what’s your raya, though? So therefore, that’s the question to them. No, it’s the opposite. Tosafos, how could we say that?

They try to get rid of Tisha B'Av, meaning that there's no chiyuv to fast on Tisha B'Av. It says clearly, kol oichel v'shoseh won't have a nechamah siyon. So I'm telling you, yeah, if a person was supposed to fast and he didn't fast, he won't see the nechamah siyon. But if the person doesn't have to fast, who says? Ela mai, what does Tosafos mean, that Tzarich you have to mis'abel Yerushalayim? Do it another way. A person's supposed to take chatzai. What's the shaylah? Also, you have to say, I wrote this, maybe the only, the ikar yesod of aveilus is the fast of Tisha B'Av. Chiddush. No, because the kasuv means that not only achilah, the whole aveilus of Tisha B'Av, without that. Maybe you want to be mechalel, take everything away. Who says? Because lack Tisha B'Av. Lack Tisha B'Av is not achilah. Tosafos means therefore there wouldn't be an aveilus. I'm saying, and why can't you be mis'abel by saying Tichatzai on Tuesday before Tisha B'Av? That's not what he's doing. So how do you see it in the zecher of Yeremiah and the Chamaso? It's very poshut. You have to have aveilus. You know how you'll have the aveilus? By saying Tichatzai Tuesday before Tisha B'Av. Again, I know what I'm trying to say. Tosafos, the Gemara wants to say no Tisha B'Av. That can't be. That can't be. Why? Because l'maaseh, kol oichel v'shoseh b'Tisha B'Av, eino ro'eh b'nechamah. So what's the kasha? On the fact that you have to fast? No, because if you don't have to fast, then you don't have to fast. So what's the ta'ina? Because then you won't be zoicheh to see b'nechamah. That's the problem? Yeah. So maybe only not zoicheh b'nechamah if you're supposed to fast, it is. That's kasha number one. Ela mai, what does Tosafos mean? It seems a person that's mis'abel Yerushalayim, how dare he come and take away the Tisha B'Av? I'll answer you: Tisha B'Av, not. Other ways you'll be mis'abel Yerushalayim. That's what I'm telling you. That's what I'm telling you. You see from here that the ikar way of being mis'abel Yerushalayim is to keep the hilchos Tisha B'Av. That's what Tosafos is. Otherwise Tosafos could have learned, you know what, A, you're not mechuyav to fast, fine. You're not mechuyav... And I'm saying, the Gemara, when it said there wants to be, wants to be, wants to be, ... doesn't mean ... the day. ... If you don't think that, I don't know if that's true. Who said? You want to stick to chatzai. If you want to stick to chatzai, that's what the ... about. I'm asking, if you want to stick to chatzai, who says you want to stick to chatzai? It won't have the ... ... Why does ... do more than six ... every day? Because it's more. It's one day ... plus ... It's good, so I already take away ... You know what I'm saying? You're missing the point. If Rebbe said no Tisha, right? Did he come and say not to be misabel on the Beis HaMikdash? No, he just said no Tisha. That's all he said. You can be misabel in many ways. You want to something now is the music. Why not? Aveilus is Tisha. What do you mean? There are many ways. There are many things that you're involved. No, so תשעה, says, if Rebbe wants to be oiker Tisha, right? So what's your kasha? Kol oiker davar sheb'issur is not going to have a nechamas Tzion. What do you mean? He was matir that, that's in the maila, that won't be a problem. What's the problem? So teretz is, right? You hear other meforshim try to say teretz of kasha. Rebbe, because l'aker, I kol oiker davar sheb'issur, eino ra'ui b'nechamas Tzion. I don't see it. That's only if he was supposed to sit. Supposed to sit, and he didn't sit. So what does Tisha want? Maybe Rebbe being l'aker won't be a problem. Ela mai, what does Tisha mean? Tisha is not a means like this. If there's a chiyuv aveilus, so how could Rebbe want to be oiker the aveilus? That's what he means. You won't have nechamas Tzion if you won't have aveilus. So how could Rebbe take away Tisha? Yeah, that's— Tisha is like that. Tisha begins Rebbe wanting to be oiker it לגמרי. It was mamash. Right, he didn't hold like Maseches Taanis. Comes along the Taisis. This is how— what do you mean? Kol oiker davar sheb'issur, what are you talking about? Teretz is, only if I have to sit and I don't, then I have a problem. So what does Taisis want? Teretz is, Taisis wants to say, how can it be oiker Tisha, but you have to be misabel on Yerushalayim? That's the problem. I'm asking you a question if that's what it means, so you have to be misabel other ways. What's pshat in Rebbe? Teretz is, yeah. Ah, see, that's an example like this. If you understand what I want. Ela mai, the teretz is that if you're saying aveilus of Tisha, so that's Taisis. Okay, I'm just learning with you Taisis. Okay, continue Taisis with another yesod. Okay, now you have— this isn't what we want. Yeah? Chat, chat, chat, chat. Yeah? Okay, then it says Taisis like this. Says Taisis. Tell me, what time is it? What time is it? So, ein beisn yachol levatel divrei beis din chaveiro. How could you ever already want to be oiker? How you can't be mevatel divrei beis din chaveiro? ... What he said. What he said. ... ela mechumah sheyesh bo mesar ta'anim.

Not mamish oiker, but he wants to make it like all other ... Binami, ... that's the pshat you're telling. He says from nine to ten, but he don't want to be oiker לגמרי. I don't understand. You know why? He wants to make it— No, that's oiker. What's he talking about? You look at ... his teretz contradicts his kasha. His kasha was, how could someone today change what they were ...? Give us—what does it mean that you're okay? ... Whatever you did, you're not gonna do that. You can't come and change what Beis Din ... If they came and said ... was more chamur, that was a takanah. Tisha B'Av is worse than that. So you come and say no, it's not? So it's no good. Why not? So it's no good. What is ...? ... Next day, ... the whole din of ... now the next day. Explain to me why you can't be oiker. You want to explain to me why you can't be oiker? Oiker doesn't mean to uproot something completely. You can't be cholek on them. No, you can't be cholek on Beis Din because they're bigger than you. I'm asking you, what's the halachah? What is halachah? Are you allowed to argue with Beis Din before you? No. So what's there to talk about? I don't want to show what Tosafos wants. If they came and said Tisha B'Av should be on Tishi, and they say it should be on Asiri, that's not arguing with them. If their takanah was it should be on Tisha B'Av and you came and put it on Asiri, that's not called arguing with them? That's not called arguing? I don't know what is. That's not. It was a kasha. The eid Beis Din are allowed to be ... I don't know. But it's not קשיא on the first kasha. No, it's a new sugya, a new problem. The Rebbe wants to be oiker from Tishi to Asiri. No, this is not ... Not true. That's a Rashi. Tosafos says that Rebbe stopped wanting to change Tisha B'Av from some cheeseh series, because main strength was on a series. No. First Tosafos says, how could Rebbe bechalal talk over here? ... That's not true. Tosafos. Teretz number one is that he wanted to take with a chumrah of Tisha B'Av. They made Tisha B'Av more chamur. No, Tisha B'Av's not ... because that's what they made. That's what they made. If they made that Tisha B'Av shouldn't be like Shar taaniyos, why are you not allowed to wash yourself on Tisha B'Av? Who made that takanah? That's ... right? So how could Rebbe be ... Rebbe wants to take a shower on Tisha B'Av. Why? It's not as big. It's just like Shabbos ... That's not called ... Second kasha. I'm saying, he asks a second kasha. He gives two terutzim, and both of them don't make sense. Rashi learns it is pushed off. ... Rashi learns it that way, that they wanted to ... Rashi learns they wanted to do that year, because that year was a special case. He says no, bichlal, they wanted because they had basiri. Like Rebbe said, ... I wouldn't make Tisha B'Av on the tenth day. What's the kasha on the tenth? Huh? Because it burned. The main burning was on the tenth day. So how ... That's why ... First, I'm saying, I mean the takanah was on the ninth, and he said ... that's not ... What is it? It's not to do with the first thing. It's a new question. After you have argued with the ... That's not two different terutzim. Teretz number one is he wanted to take with a chumrah of Tisha B'Av. Question number two is he wanted to remove it to ... Both terutzim don't make sense, because it was less. He wanted to ... The second reason is because he held the ... was then. The chumrah he wanted because there was no more Tisha B'Av anymore. He held there was no reason for it. I think the pshat is this. I'll tell you, I don't think it's my own. I heard this somewhere. I heard it somewhere. I don't know, maybe ... I heard it from somebody. I heard this from somebody. Probably with the Teretz. If it's not his, he should be meichel me, and you should learn it anyway because it's good. And if it is, he's zocheh l'learn it because he's a baal ha-Teretz. Now listen carefully. The very same Rambam that we spoke about, ma'aseh korbanos. Where's the Rambam? Here. The Rambam paskens, we spoke already, k'dei yimakriv korbanos. Makrivin korbanos af al pi she'ein bayis banui, because the kedushah is there, as we spoke about. The land itself is kadosh, Beis HaMikdash is there. And the reason is because kedushah rishonah kidshah l'sha'atah v'kidshah l'asid lavo. The Rambam is cholek on that. The Rambam says we don't makriv korbanos today because kedushah rishonah kidshah l'sha'atah, so the rest of Eretz Yisrael, for the rest of Eretz Yisrael. But Yerushalayim, it's not. Okay? He says like this in the Gemara.

Therefore, this takanah ... arrived at ... only for the rest of ... Kiddushin mikdash we don't have today. We have kedushah; kedushin are ... but kiddushah mikdash we don't have. And he explains, because he knew that the Beis HaMikdash would be charev, so therefore Ezra, l'chatchilah, only made it l'shaah. He knew eventually, anyway, it's going to be charev. Originally, when he made the kedushah, says the Raivid, he made it l'shaah. Wow. So he knew that eventually it's going to re-need a dedication from the Ribbono Shel Olam. Kach niglu li misod Hashem lire'av. You know the lashon of the Raivid? Where do I know this from? It was niglu li misod Hashem lire'av. Lefikach hanichnas atah sham ein bo kares, says the Raivid. Therefore, if you go there now, there's no kares. ... He says by lulav also. He says by lulav. He says, ruach hakodesh, basically, there's no kares. There's no kares. Not both. This is the Raivid. Get, so this is the Raivid. Shitah, the Raivid, the Rambam. Okay. Now, I want to show you like this. This is the vort I heard from Rav ... that Rebbe's shitah is like the Rambam, that you're makriv korbanos ... I'll show you where it comes from. It's an interesting Gemara Yevamos. Gemara Yevamos, I think it's ayin tes, right? Ayin tes. ... Ayin tes. It says like this. You have the machlokes, the Rambam, the Raivid. Okay. The Gemara says like this. Bimei Rebbe, big shuhah to the nesinim. I don't know, Rebbe's times they wanted to matir a lot of things they wanted to be matir. So the ... they also wanted to be matir nesinim. You know what nesinim are? Nesinim was the people, the water carriers. Right, so there was a— no, not nesinim, they were ... They were considered like ... geirim, not that ... Elinairis. You know Elinairis? The whole ... Right. ... So it says, Rashi, how could they be matir it? Here: ... ... So who's going to be matir the ...? ... Well, pligi d'Rabbi Chiya bar Abba. The other Chiya bar Abba, רבי יוחנן, ... ... Rabbi Chiya argues and he says no, the ... will always be asur. ... So what does Rebbe hold? What Rebbe holds like this here. Upligi d'Rabbi Chiya, d'amar ... ... ... So the ... argues directly on Rabbi Chiya. So what's pshat Rebbe? Rabbi Chiya came and said that there's no Beis HaMikdash, there's no ... There's no ... You don't need to shecht the korbanos for you, so what's the ...? They wanted to matir ... free people, free them in ... They stood in front of Rebbe's White House and they were screaming. Nothing. So that's no ... The shaila is if there's no ... let's go ... let's go be matir the ... But they had a din ... I don't know, they had a din ... ... Maybe, maybe, maybe. You never know. You didn't know this Gemara? There you go. You know the Gemara, very, very ridiculous. ... Impossible. Impossible. Why? Because hefsed b'hefsed. In momonus, he could do it. In momonus, he could do it. Hefsed b'hefsed works in momonus. In momonus, he could do it. That ta'inas kas, I hefsed b'hefsed. The ta'ina is for momonus, he could do it. Yeah, but what about the chelkas behefd that Rebbe wants to be matir? No, what's the sugya? Again, bimei Rebbe, bikshu l'hatir nesinim. They came up and they wanted to be matir nesinim. So Rebbe told them, in out loud, Why? Because this is a ... chelek. No, no. But the chelek b'hefd meatir. Comes along Reb Chiya and he says you can't be matir the chelek b'hefd. Why? Because you can't be matir our chelek, because our chelek is ... And ela mai, you worry about chelek b'hefd? There is no chelek b'hefd today. So what did Rebbe hold? Rebbe holds there is chelek b'hefd. How can there be chelek b'hefd? ... That's the machlokes. That's what I heard from ... Very nice vort. You hear the vort? Again, Rebbe says like this: I know you're all jumpy, I know you're all jumpy. It's so hot. That's life. Life is too big. Bimei Rebbe, bikshu l'hatir nesinim. They came, they wanted to matir nesinim. אמר להן רבי, חכינו, נתיר חלק בהפד. So Rebbe says, What about the chelek b'hefd?

Good, I'll ... here. Comes along, pligah d'Rabbi Chiya. So Rashi explains the ... d'Rabbi Chiya, that according to Rabbi Chiya, for keres, chelev mizbeach, you don't have to be matir. The chelek, the chelek, what you call it, the chelek eidah, you can't be matir. That's the machlokes. So what's takanas Rabbi holds, the chelev mizbeach he can't be matir? There is a chelev mizbeach. Today, Rabbi Chiya says there's nothing to be matir; there's no mizbeach. They don't have to work for your korbanos because there is no korbanos. So what did Rabbi hold? Rabbi holds matir, because ein ba'is banui. So the etzem they have a chiyuv to the mizbeach. Is— is Rabbi and Rabbi Chiya. Okay, now, now thinking, what's the pshat? Pshat's like this. It comes out that Rabbi, who holds makrivin af al pi she'ein bayis banui, and what did we say? Aleihu l'chosko eineinu. What was the yesod of Tisha B'Av, we ta'inen from the ... is the korbanos. ... Rabbi wants to be matir from korbanos. Rabbi holds you can be makriv korbanos ... Oh. I'm talking about maybe Rabbi ... on the side of ... wants to take away the chomer. Wants to take away the chomer. Rabbi holds makrivim. That's why Rabbi holds ... That's Tosafos thought it meant. Then Tosafos says, no, it means to take away the chomer of it. It's just like every other ... I'm asking, why would Rabbi want to take away the chomer of it? Just because according to him there's no chomer. The whole chomer of the thing is the korbanos. So Rabbi could be now just for the makom of korbanos. His wife looks at me and he's going, wow, wow. I'll show you that it's mefurash in Rambam. Nayes. Tell me, during the first Beis HaMikdash and during the second Beis HaMikdash, did they fast Tisha B'Av? Think about it. During the Beis HaMikdash was up. No, no, the ... they fasted during the first and second Beis HaMikdash. I can't hear, what? Asur? What's asur? What did you say? Poo? Why? Because ... simcha. So let me show him his big grubber type that he's making over here. The tashbatz answers for a kasha. Now let me explain to you what it is. The Rambam in Meseches, the son, the Pirush Mishnayos, is clearly that they fasted three Tishah B'Avs also. Matzinu the sefer Tishah B'Av that the Mishnah says over there, and Rav Sheshas was Tishah B'Av too. The hainu b'zman HaMikdash. The Gemara says, matzinu ma'aseh Tishah B'Av. They used to say not shmuchim that they should know when Tishah B'Av is. Zogt the Rambam, Pirush Mishnayos, even b'zman Beis HaMikdash, they fasted. Even b'zman Beis HaMikdash they fasted. The Tashbatz. Here's kasha. Zogt the Tashbatz a grube kasha. You know why? Because the Rambam says clearly, yihyeh l'sason. The Rambam learns when Moshiach is come. It's not going on now. It's not going on now, when Moshiach. Avada, it's going on Moshiach. The nevuah of yihyeh l'sason. Also, I'm telling you because also, what's the question? The Rambam says himself why. So you ready? I'll read it for you. You'll see. For what I'm saying, you'll soon see. Lo yasaru b'teves, v'lo Yud-Zayin b'Tammuz, ela mi she'rotzeh l'sane. Mi she'rotzeh loya mesane. Okay, it's not assur. Lo yasaru b'Teves, Yud-Zayin b'Tammuz. How you doing? U'mipnei sheloyatzu al Teves v'al Tammuz. And that's why in the Mishnah they didn't go out on Teves and Tammuz, right? Amar Hashem yisbarach, ... v'revii, nir'eh k'mo shena'asu b'yadam habechirah, ratzu misane, ratzu v'tamuz, v'tamuz revii, u'Yud-Zayin b'Tammuz. Tzom chamishi, Tishah B'Av, chodesh chamishi. U'fi sheb'chodesh ... b'yadam sheloyasu l'sane b'Tishah B'Av, hayu mistanim bo. They fasted anyway, says the Rambam. ... kifas min ha'evel she'ira bo k'mo she... Okay, sit down. Sit down. ... Did they fast? The answer is yes. Rambam says they fasted. Facts is, they say. ... They say. ... I don't know that. Because the Rambam, that's not true. One sec, one sec, one sec, one sec. What do you want from me? I don't know. What do you want from me? What do you want from me?

That's out the Rambam. The Rambam says, ... because when the second one came, there was no problem in the Beis HaMikdash anymore. Why cry about a Beis HaMikdash that you have already? No, because it wasn't destroyed. So that's what you say. It's machlokes between the Rambam. Terrible things. ... The Gemara says, ... That's the pshat. When the Gemara came and said the Rambam weren't, then we're not guilty for one; we're guilty for all of them. So you don't ... You're not learning the pshat in the Mishnah. It's not the events that took place, but it's the many events that took place. It's not this or this; it's the whole thing. ... Give me a minute. Rebbeין, different than the Rambam in this nekudah. Rebbe paskened that the reason why we have churban is the churban, korbanos. We have the korbanos to be ... Rebbe bikshu. The meileh, I hold that that's ... What would ...? The Rambam says clearly there's two different types of chilukim. When you ... on the takanah that they were mesaken, that you can't do. But you can argue in halacha. You can argue and say, I pasken differently than the ... I'll show you. It's in Hilchos ... perek aleph. We'll read it together. The Rambam, ... perek aleph. No, no, no. Where's the Rambam? ... Same ... בין בזה ... אחד מטהר ואחד מטמא, שני חכמים, או שני בעלי דינים, ... או עד שלא היה דבר בורר להם, בין בזמן אחד בין בזמן אחר. You see clearly, ... right? Rambam says clearly, ... אחד מטהר ואחד מטמא, אחד אוסר ואחד מתיר, ... What do you do? ... What do you mean? ... It's not halacha. What? Says nothing. We hold there's no such thing. What do you mean? You never had it. But b'zacha, that's the... b'zacha's there. What do you mean? So how do you know? You never have yichud b'zacha there. What do you mean? Wait a second. In halacha there's no machlokes, and a Chanami. So, that's the teretz. So good. That, that, no like this. So b'meila רבי ביקש. Pshat is because Rebbe held halacha different. That's because the whole thing is based on—what's pshat in the Rambam? The Rambam learns it's chukah b'lo ta'am. What's the pshat chukah b'lo ta'am? It's the yom hamuchal of pronius.