Hilchos Vestos: Veses Kavua, Onah Beinis, and the Meaning of Kol HaMarbeh Livdok

Transcript

Kuf pei daled, se'if aleph. רוב הנשים יש להם וסת. What is vestes? פירוש, זמן קבוע, אורח כנשים, לראות בזמן ידוע. כגון, מעשרים יום לעשרים יום, עשרים לעשרים יום, או מל' לל'. So the Shulchan Aruch tells me two things: rov, not all, but rov. It's not a kula, like a chazakah that that's the way it is, but rov. Rov is that way. Mitzvas Hashem, we'll discuss if the rov still applies today. Is today also rov nashim yesh lahem vestes, liros bizman kavua? Also, I'd like to point out, מעשרים לעשרים יום, ומלמד—there's two examples that he brings. He brings מעשרים לעשרים יום and מל' לל'. If you look at the Beis Yosef, he brings a third example. For example, 25, 15, 25. Why is it that here in the Mechaber, in the Maran, he doesn't bring the different days that he brings in the Beis Yosef? So I would say pshat is like this, pshat, poshut pshat. He doesn't want to say only one example other than 30. I'm sorry, he doesn't want to say only 30. Because we're soon going to learn, thirty is considered a veses kavua even for someone who doesn't have a veses kavua, oina beinonis. So therefore he gives one other example, roiv hanashim, ... right? The roiv is even not to see oina beinonis. The roiv is to see me'esrim l'esrim yom. There's no need for him to speak other cases, because it's a Shulchan Aruch, he's condensing, and if it's twenty, then it's all that. It's always twenty, twenty-two, twenty-five, whatever. It doesn't have to be dafka twenty. And the thirty he chooses, like the Shach is going to explain, because thirty is considered taka veses kavua even for someone who doesn't have a veses. So to only say thirty, you wouldn't know twenty. To say twenty, you wouldn't know the Shach's halacha of thirty. Between twenty and thirty you have everything covered. That's how I would learn the pshat in the Mechaber, and it's emes la'amito. To teach me that I have to let me talk and you have to listen. That's what it's to teach. Otherwise there's no shiur. Again, roiv hanashim yesh lahem veses. Most women have veses. פירוש זמן קבוע. So I guess it means veses kavua. When it says veses, it means already veses kavua, liros bizman yadua. So we spoke about the word roiv. Notice that he didn't say that it's a chazakah, like it's standard. Most. Notice that probably he's talking about his times. Doesn't mean necessarily it's that way today also. So that's the first thing that you have to be me'ayer. Roiv. Does the word roiv play a crucial role in the halacha l'maaseh of this halacha? Because he starts off with roiv. So maybe only because it's roiv do these halachos apply, whatever we're going to learn. But if let's say it's not roiv, if let's say it would have been more than roiv or less than roiv, or if today it's not the way it's roiv noshim, the way he sets up the halacha, then we have to ask if these halachos apply. Did everybody understand what I just said? I just said a mouthful for someone who knows the information. For someone who doesn't know, it's simple diyuk, roiv. What do you want? What do I want? I want a lot. I want to know if this halacha must begin from the word roiv, or it's just an example. Maybe the mechaber is just talking. Hey, he's teaching you science. You have to know most women, you learn halacha, you're a bachur out of yeshiva, you're learning Hilchos Niddah, you're getting married, you're learning, so you don't know. So he's teaching you, right, noshim have...

Idilma, the halacha is dependent. Whatever he's going to teach us in this halacha is dependent on the word roiv. That's called learning Shulchan Aruch. There's another way how you can learn Shulchan Aruch. You know how you can learn it? You could take out the green sefer and read: yenida, not nida, yarcha, not archa. You're supposed to put a piece of candy between you and your wife, and you're supposed to put a plate, and then, then you're very good. That's one way how you can learn. Or you can learn it by reading what it says. Roiv. Does roiv mean history? Does roiv mean sipur dvarim ba'alma? Or does roiv play a crucial role in this se'if, that all the halachos that are here are dependent on the word roiv? Meaning, it's not 90 percent; it's roiv. What's roiv? 51. Roiv is not 90 percent; it's 51 percent. Is it less? No. Maybe it could be less or more, but it's not roiv. Or roiv is bedavka. The second question is if it's today different, would this halacha change? The second thing we have to me'ayer is he gives two examples: me'ashim l'ashrim, oy milamed l'lamed. So it's only kegon; it's not the only two examples. And my proof is because the Beis Yosef taka brings a bunch of other examples. So then my question is, so why taka the Mechaber does he only bring these two examples? And the answer is very simple, because if you learn the Shach and you learn the Taz, the Shach will explain that lamed is irrelevant; it's always called a vest. And that's why the Mechaber brings it. So therefore he had to bring esrim, because esrim is keis, lamed is always. Now, if he only brought esrim, you wouldn't know that lamed is always, so he brings both, according to the Shach it's miyushiv. Now why does he bring the other cases? Because he doesn't have to sit and bring him a calendar in Shulchan Aruch, right? Now why does the Beis Yosef feel he has to write it? Okay, because it's true. It's a kasha, but in Shulchan Aruch he condensed halachos, negea to a vest kavua, which is your kovea, and then the lamed of lamed, which is mimeila kavua, and that's what the Shach says. Okay. What is this lamed yom? says the Shach. Oymi lamed, mistam vest milamed yom. Mistam vest is lamed yom. V'cheinu b'shaas u'poskim, u'lekamon sof sif tes, v'hainu, what's it negea? What's it negea that there's a kvius vest, lamed, which we call oina beinonis? What's so important about that? Because im loi kava vest. It's a case where you were not kovea vest, mistama vesta kol lamed. Her vesta is kol lamed, mistama vesta kol lamed. U'bsoich lamed mikri sheloi b'shaas vest, and therefore within thirty it's called sheloi b'shaas vest. Okay. Now what does it negea? What does that mean? Right? Again, he explains a very interesting thing. Oh, you see, he brings the first thing I told you, oylechafer l'lamed, right? Veis Yosef u'pashut hu, v'stam vest mi-lamed yom. Stam vest is 30 days. V'chein hu b'sha'as ufoskin l'kaman se'if tes. What does that mean? V'hainu im lo kava vest. It means if you were not kovea vest. V'stama vesta kol lamed. Uv'soch lamed mikri shelo b'shaas vestah. So therefore, within 30 is called shelo b'shaas vest. What's the... So pashut he means that you don't need a bedikah, right? Because the Mechaber talks about kvias vest, you need bedikos. So if it's lamed, so toch lamed, says the Shach, is considered shelo b'shaas vest. Shelo b'shaas vest, you wouldn't need a bedikah. Comes along the Kreisi uPleisi, and he reads this and he says, What? What are you talking about? It's mefurash halacha that if you don't have a kvias vest, you always have to check. You always need bedikos. What is he saying? Shach, you argue with mefurash halachos? I'd like everybody to take a look at siman kuf pei vav, se'if beis. And if you see that he says the same thing like the Shach.

And you're a magician. But if you see that he says the exact opposite than the Shach, then you read what it says over there. Yeah, im ein laves kavuah. Shalosh pe'amim harishonim, sheyachol livdok kodem tashmish. Okay, so what is he talking about? What's the Shach telling you that? So again, does everybody understand what the Shach wants? You understand what the Shach wants? He's trying to tell me that lamed yom is eina beinus, and anything between the before that, you don't have to worry about. No chiyuv bedikah, because the whole Shulchan Aruch is that this seifa that you have to be bodek. You don't have to be bodek when what? When the vest is eina beinus. You don't have to be bodek. Comes along the Kreisi u'Pleisi and says, I don't want to, you know, disturb you, the Shach, but I mean, you pasken kneged the Mechaber that says differently. I mean, and it's funny that you're saying it in the Mechaber. Bishlam if you want to say different than the Mechaber, okay, Shach sometimes does that. But you can't come and say that that's what the Mechaber means. V'hainu, heinu b'shaas. V'hainu, you're explaining that this is what it means here. How could you explain it means this? Now I'd like to teach you that of course the Shach didn't miss a mefurash Mechaber. It doesn't make sense, right? So the Chavos Daas and the Sidrei Taharah and many others after them say we have to learn pshat over here. Something is not right. To learn it that the Shach made a mistake and he missed an open Mechaber is impossible. So now let's pay close attention, close attention to the words of the Shach. And to the words of the Mechaber, okay? V'hainu im loi kavah vest. What does it mean, im loi kavah vest? What does that mean? You have any idea what it means? Huh? Never happened yet. Never happened. How do you know? I could tell you—you know what? I'm going to tell you another way how you could read this, and I'm matmia on you how you didn't know that you could read it this way too, because I don't know what makes you think you read it right. I'll tell you another way. Loi kavah vest—you see, so forty times she saw, but every time it's a different day, right? See, he says right one way, you say right the other way, and everybody's right. Everybody's right. He said the opposite of him, and he makes—yeah, pashut—and he makes the opposite. It's pashut. What was the case of Meran and the Mechaber in Kuf Pei Vav, se'if beis? What was that case? You know the case over there? In ein lah vest kevuah, shalosh pa'amim harishoinim. That's before. The Mechaber is talking about when there was בכלל nothing. Either she never had her period before, or she wasn't paying attention to what's going on, or she just got married, or whatever the story is. But if, let's say, she taka has—hey, gadol, this is you paying attention to me. You know what I'm talking about? Very simple. I'm reading. You said you want to read. Okay, so let's read here. Im loi kavah vest. What does that mean? It can mean one of two things. It could either mean loi kavah vest because she never had periods yet; it's the first three times. And if that's what the Shach means, then he's arguing on the Mefurash of Shulchan Aruch. Orikiminim, loy kava vest is after three times, yeah? It's after three times. But what's loy kava vest mean? That there's no day. Every day is different. Every month it comes out different. And then the shach is not arguing. That's how the Chavos Daas, the Sidrei Taharah, they make like a pshara. They're trying to make harmony that it all fits. The Shach knew, and the Shach is saying b'pshat, everything fits. Okay. What's the difference if it's the first three times and then you have a bedikah, or im loy kava vest? What is the difference? Oh, what did you just say? Oh, look at this, something very interesting. Rafi, could you tell the oilam here the difference? What would be the difference? This is no vest and this is no vest. How do you know what the teretz is? This is no vest and this is no vest. One is that she doesn't have a vest, and one is that she has no vest. There's a muchzak not to have a vest. So kol zman she's not muchzak to not have a vest.

There's the halacha that you have to what? Be bodek. Ma she'ein kein, where she's muchzek not to have a vest, then maybe you're not mechuyav to be bodek till oina beinonis. Wow, this is interesting. This is interesting. Yeah. I mean, I'm not even saying big chidush, it's what it says here. I'm not reading you more than what it says. So far it's not Rabbi Wolkin's chidush, it's what it says. You read a Shach. The Shach is mefurash mechaber the opposite, so you have to say something's wrong here. And the Teretz is because you have to read it properly, and when you read it properly you'd see that there's a whole different Shach. It has nothing to do with the Shulchan Aruch. You're saying that the first time she sees a period in her life, there's no such thing as shelo b'shaas vestah; she has to check. Yeah, I'm saying, I'm not saying the Mechaber says that. That's kuf pei-vav. Later in life, after three times, four times, five times, six times that she's on different days, so she's kavua not have a vest, so therefore she's not mechuyav to be bodek till the lamed. Chavas Daas? You see differently in the Mechaber? It says in the sources, it looks like it's the opposite. Okay, so that's where it comes from, the Pischei Teshuvah. I'm quoting you the Pischei Teshuvah. He's quoting you the Chavas Daas. The Pischei Teshuvah says whenever she has—when she's chazakah, ein lah vestah, tzrichah l'olam bedikah. And the other way, the first time she doesn't need a bedikah. Same thing Rabbi's saying, only the opposite. The same thing. Who is he quoting? Who is he quoting? Let's do that. Ad rabah. Where is—yeah. No, where's the Piskei... here? Ein shacht. L'kov ves mikri b'soch lamed, sheloy b'shaas vestah, ma shetzarich bedikah toch lamed. Mai mekares? Peshitah. He brings the case. Peshitah. Ki mekasuv, l'chilah asru me'asa sheloy noi d'l'maaseh tikva ves mikri b'soch lamed. Right. V'ein tzarich bedikah, aval k'shenischazek d'ein lo ves, tzricha. He says it a little differently. Interesting, but that's not how the Chavas Daas brings it down. What? No, you have to see. Okay, look at the Chavas Daas. Okay, I mean, but one thing I do see from here, that there's a chiluk between no vest and nischazek not to have a vest. Pischei Teshuvah says the exact opposite of what I said. I said it one way, and the Pischei Teshuvah said it the other way. I have a very big problem. I mean, the Chavas Daas talks—huh? There's nothing to check. The story of the Chavas Daas is the mechaber. Wait a second. And the mechaber talks about which case? The way I said it, right? So there's a problem, right? I mean, if it's my way of saying it or his way of saying it, blah blah blah, what's pshat? This Chavas Daas is coming to meyashev the mechaber. That's what it's coming for. And the mechaber says clearly that tochriyasa—huh? But the... it seems to say the same way as the Pischei Teshuvah. I know, but you have to see the Chavas Daas. I'm coming to the Chavas Daas. Guess what? I don't want it to be wrong, but I just feel that you should learn it, that's all. If you come back to me second seder and show me that the mechaber—listen, I'm quoting you mechaber—that tochriyasa you need a bedikah, so then it's... I'm saying it right. I have to be saying it right because I'm coming from the mechaber. Okay. What is the Seforas HaDvarim? The Seforas HaDvarim is that there's two things. There's such a thing called ein lo, ein lo vest, and then there's such a thing called ein lo vest, that muchzak not to have a vest. Muchzak. She's muchzak not to have a vest. If you learn that she has no vest, right? I mean, I hear what he's saying. Once it's muchzak not to have a vest, then you taka don't need a bedikah. I hear what he's saying, okay. But I'll tell you how I hear my way also. I'll explain to you where I'm coming from. What is onah beinonis? What is—where does it come from? Why is it that way? So the Gemara makes it a language, a lashon. There's a regilus. The regilus of women is onah beinonis, of the regular average. The average is beinoni. Average is thirty days, okay? There's a machlokes Rishonim, the Ran and the Rashba. And if you'd like to know where this comes from, it's also—

The pischei teshuva. To me, that's why matmia that he says it this way. The pischei teshuva is in kuf pei tes, seif katan yud. Why oina beinus? The Ran says because at some point we have to say she's going to definitely see. I mean, what, she's just not going to see? So when it hits thirty, we're going to have to start worrying and saying, you know what, at some point she's going to be seeing. That's how the Ran learns. At thirty, we start saying, Watch, she's sick. What's wrong with her? So the teretz is she probably will see. Because that's it. At that point, it's starting to become way over the limit. But it's, vechilah olam lo sira. That's the lashon of the Ran. What, do you think she's never going to see? I mean, at some point we have to say she'll see. The Rashba learns that the pshat is, no, it's an orech of a beinoni. It's a set time, and the beinoni has this orech, so therefore it's like a kavua. It's not a safek, a me'eletz kavua. It is a kavua. There's such a thing called, if a woman doesn't have her own personal orech, like for example, if you don't have your own lawyer, the government appoints you a lawyer. So here too, we appoint to her an orech. We appoint to her a... So that's what I want to get at. Let's discuss this. According to the Ran, according to the Ran, what's the taich of oina beinus? Oina beinus is... When you're not nikva, when you're not nikva for something, right? So at some point we have to say, you know what, this is the last day where we're starting to think it's got to come, right? So you're not nikva toch lamed. You're not nikva toch lamed, which makes it—it's possible to be before, but the probability is now. Then you would have to have a bedikah in toch lamed. Masha'en kein if the taich is that when you don't have—we appoint you a kvius, we give you an oirech, so kol zman you have that oirech of lamed, it's a stirah to be bodek before. You're contradicting yourself by being bodek before. Now my question is, so for that do I need to be nikva that I don't see? So if you learn like the Ran, I don't need to be nikva that I don't see. But according to the Rashba, in order to give you a set lamed, I have to first be nikva that I don't see. Okay, I'm going to repeat it, because it's a masterpiece. It's a masterpiece. You ready? You want to see what—I think you understood what I just said. You understood me? I'll try. Okay, so I'm going to repeat it. I started off by discussing the word ro'iv. Ro'iv is a very, very—what's—precise, precise category. There's everyone. There's koloilam. There's chazakah, which is a shaila is chazakah metzius, a chazakah is a raya, whatever, but it's more than just rov. Then there's rov. And for some reason, the mechaber begins this halacha with rov nashim. So either he's telling me just I should know history, I should know, you should know the metzius, otherwise you don't know what it is at all, right? Or it's dependent bedavka on the rov. Then I showed you it's interesting that he brings two examples. What are the two examples? Esrim and lamed. And when I said that it's not a big raya for much, the fact that he brought these two examples, because it makes sense, especially like the Shach explains, because lamed is eino beinonis and becomes kavua whether or not you have a different, okay. Then the Shach explains, taka what's the lamed? The lamed is because lamed is an eino beinonis, so im lo nikva vest, mimeila umistama kol lamed. What's it again? That toch lamed is called not vest. It's called shelo b'shaas vest, and shelo b'shaas vesta there's no chiyuv bedikah. Comes along the Kreisi u'Pleisi and he says it's not true. He says it's not like that. The Mechaber says differently. So the mefarshim say, oh yeah, it's not a stirah.

But because man she wasn't kovea vest, then the halacha is, meaning she never saw, then she has to be bodek. But once she's kovea that she doesn't have a vest, then toch lamed she doesn't have to be bodek. And he shows me that it says differently over here. Fine, but I'm answering the mechaber; mechaber says that that way. Okay. Now, what do you see from here? That the fact that you don't have a vest might not be enough. It has to be that we know that you don't have a vest. It's very possible that the mere fact that you don't have a vest tells me, you know what, you better still be bodek even if you have a ona beinonis. Why? And the answer is, if you understood what ona beinonis is, you would see that it's very crucial to understand this halacha. If ona beinonis means that at some point we have to say, you know what, she's not six, so it's got to be. I mean, so today is the day that it's got to be. So then what happened till that day? I mean, till that day, it wasn't kovea that she doesn't have. It's that she might have, but she might not have, and at a certain point we say, you know what, today is, we're not waiting anymore. That's the raya. So I don't need to have an ona beinonis that the toch ona beinonis is what? That it's nikva that she doesn't have. But if you learn like the Razba, that the Razba says we're giving you an orah, this is it, this is your time, and you become nikva for that, so then it has to be that within— You are nikva to not have. Let me use this. This becomes your veses kavua. One is an anticipation, and one is that this is your orekh, this is your cycle. The Rashba says it's your cycle. So in order to give you that cycle, you have to be nikva not to have. When you're nikva not to have, it's eina chanami. So we can look at it both ways. You're nikva not to have, and meileh there's no chiyuv bedikah. There's nothing to be bodek if it's nikva not to have. Now, I'd like to go a little further in the halachah. Keep this in mind. We'll get back to this a little bit later. Now, there's a whole talk in today's poskim. I'm not going to mention names of those poskim, because they made big waves about it, that today אונס בנות doesn't apply. Today אונס בנות doesn't apply. Why? Because it's not the אונס בנות anymore. It's just not. In other words, most women don't have thirty days. They don't have it. As a matter of fact, today there's nothing which is... Where's the cycle? Oh, he's not with us with me anymore? Okay. L'choirah, it's תלוי in this shaylah, right? If you learn that וחיל העולם לא סירה... So you don't need that this takanah eina b'einus. You don't need it. At a certain point, it becomes an anticipation that it's got to be. But in order for it to be an orech kavua, could be, could be, it has to be a kavua. It has to be something. It has to be that there is a rov noshim that would have this oyna beis. Otherwise there's no such thing. If the taich is at some point, v'chilu olam loy sira, so maybe I don't need the rov for that. Maybe I don't need the rov for that. At a certain point where the safek becomes strong enough, then I would say, you know what, from here on we have to start being choshesh. I am asking maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe. I said maybe. Maybe not. V'adilma, if you learn that the taich is that it's an orech kavua, the moment the rov doesn't have it, then it's not an orech kavua. Many poskim held like this, and they did away with oyna beinus, and it was a big, big controversy, big controversy. What I'm saying is it's not muchach because of what we just said. Because even in the Ran, if you learn that it's an anticipation.

Patient, right? We could say that we can only anticipate depending on the roi, or we could come and say that the din אונה בינונית means the Chazal kovea an ona. Once Chazal kovea the ona, it's not dependent on the individual. Again, let's do this one more time. Close attention. Is ona beinonis the woman's ona, or is ona beinonis the Chazal's ona? Now let's continue. This is a little introduction. Now I want to learn everything inside. רוב הנשים יש להן וסת, לראות בזמנן ידוע, כגון מעשרים לעשרים יום, או מל' לל' יום. כל אשה שיש לה וסת קבוע, בא עליה שלא בשעת וסתה, ואינה צריכה בדיקה לפני תשמיש. What does it mean, בא עליה שלא בשעת וסתה? Says the Taz, בטור כתב, דבא עליה כמו שירצה. What does that mean? Very, very, very harsh language, בא עליה כמו שירצה. What does it mean? So the Taz explains that it means, רצונו לומר בין שהיא ערה בין ישנה, whether she's up, whether she's sleeping. פירוש, אין ישינה לגמרי, ואם כן אסור לשמש עם הגדולה מן הנדרים. Does anybody know why? Why you're not being mishamesh with that? Yeah, but what? What's the reason? Huh? You're quoting me again the Gemara Nedarim, but what's the reason? I don't want to know. Huh? She's dreaming. So what? Let her dream. Why? Where does it say you're not allowed to dream? No, ... What did you say? She's dreaming. I don't know. You don't know, so if you don't know, why are you saying it? That's how you learn the case? Don't say she's dreaming about someone else. She's not thinking about you. In other words, it's not about אישות, it's about, it's like a lack of צניעות. It's not צניעות. I saw the Shulchan Aruch HaRav says it's a znus, it's an ones. It has nothing to do with—I mean, the Velt thinks it's an issue. It has nothing to do with צניעות. It's אונס. Interesting, huh? Okay. שלא ברצונה. It's not. Ah, now you're saying good. Now you're saying good. What happens if she says before? That's exactly what I wanted to get at. It's not about if she tells you or not. Are you listening to what my talmidei chacham, my poskim are saying here? Rav Chaimov, Rav Chaimov, my poskim are talking good stuff. They're saying good stuff. They're saying good. They're saying good. I taught them how to think. They're saying good. Yeah. Okay, so let me tell you what goes through my mind, but it's only lechidusha b'alma. I don't want any psak halacha coming out of this, okay? Because I have sveikos in that. It says בין ערה בין ישינה. Not mamash ישינה, because the Gemara Nedarim says you're not allowed to be ישינה. What's wrong with ישינה? What's wrong with— So either you learn that the yesod of bi'ah is that you need a she is participant, participant. Otherwise, if she's sleeping, then it's not good, okay? Which means is the bi'ah has to be in such a way that it's between two people. The Shulchan Aruch HaRav learns that it's not the problem so much that she's not participating as much as you're doing it b'ones. Maybe she's not maskim. Ones. So I clarified the shaila: what happens if she's maskim l'chatchila? She tells you, listen, I might be sleeping, it's no problem. It could be the taich of ones, he doesn't mean ones shelo biratzon, but it means derech ones. That's what he means, and it's taka chisaron tznius. Maybe even the Shulchan Aruch HaRav means that. The Pri Megadim, right on the matzav, exactly what I was getting. That's what you want them to say. I don't know. Let's go further. Now. What's wrong? Where are you going? Listen, now I can't go into competition with you. Okay, now.

Toras HaShlamim learns up the Taz a little different. Everybody take a look at the Toras HaShlamim. Kach kosav haTaz, he brings the Taz. Okay, bein or lyesheinah, a different pshat. You know what the chiluk is between up and sleeping? D'biyesheinah lo chazi l'taharis. When she's sleeping, she can't eat taharis, and therefore the bedikah might be only for the purpose of taharis. Ma she'ein kein b'orah d'chaziah l'taharis, al kein boi bedikah yoser. It has nothing to do with tznius, not tznius, yes tznius, not. You hear? Bein ora, bein yeshenah, bedikah, because the reason for the bedikah is for the taharis. So maybe when she's sleeping, she's not eating taharis anyway, so therefore you don't need bedikah. Kamashmalan that you have to make a bedikah bein ora, bein yeshenah. I know you lost a lot, so it's my fault that the— you know what? Let's look it out of the Shulchan Aruch. I'm reading the Toras HaShlamim. ... u'besif yud alef, nir'eh, shesover ha'ikar ha'svara shemechalek ha'shaas bein or lyesheinah. It has nothing to do with tznius. Hainu mishum d'biyeshana lo chazya l'taharis. When she's sleeping, she's not going to eat tahor pure. Memeila, there's no chiyuv bedikah maybe. Ma she'ein kein b''or d'chazya l'taharis, al kein boi bedikah yoser. V'chein פירש רש״י ... פירושה. V'im kein, l'didan d'leka taharis, so it comes out that to us, that we anyway don't have a sugya of taharis, im kein su lo shayach lechalek bein or yoshan. Therefore, you would never need a bedikah. Yeah, maybe. Do you see what's going on here? You know what this Torah is telling me? Don't learn the Shulchan Aruch the way—this is not ... This has to do with hilchos tumas שרץ. It has to do with hilchos tumah and taharah. Chavra Daniel, you hear what's going on here? It's a pele, it's a whole—and בין אור בין ישן. We're going to discuss if b'zman hazeh this whole halachah might not even apply at all. Bedikas yad, before, pashut. We're going to soon learn that maybe b'zman hazeh it's completely irrelevant. Erase it from the Shulchan Aruch. We're gonna learn this. Many poskim hold like that. The Mishnah, the teshuvos writes, light writes this. Don't pay attention to this whole halacha. It's irrelevant. Hopefully, hopefully irrelevant. Chaver, the Rama, just cut it out. It's not, it's not for our times. The Toras HaShlomim is saying, guess what? This might have something to do, nothing to do with issur nida. It has to do with taharis. Because she would become a ba'alas nidah, right? So then becomes a problem with taharis. So therefore, you should be bodek before, just to be, because anything else, you're not mechuyav to check. It's a chomer b'taharim. So bein ara bein yeshanah, maybe if she's sleeping, she's anyway not in taharis. She's not gonna go and take a sandwich of taharis afterwards. Says the Toras... mimeila, בזמננו זה, the whole thing doesn't apply because we don't have taharis anyway. Tell me, did you learn this or this is not for you? I'm not going anywhere. Maybe just explain one more time what he's saying. Yes, it says, בא לה שלא בשעת וסתה, אין צריך בדיקה. Okay, right? Says the Taz, says the Tur, bein ara bein yeshanah, what does he want? So everybody says, you know what he wants? Because bein yeshanah, you're not allowed to sleep. It has to do with hilchos siman reish mem in Yoreh Deah.

Okay? The Tereshlam says it has nothing to do with simanei shem. You know what it has to do with? It has to do with the Rambam Hilchos Taaros. Now what? Since the whole reason for the bedikah is not arayos, nidah. That's not what we're afraid of. It's a chomer for taharos. She might be tahor. She may become a boel nidah and she'll be tahor, and then we'll become tamei and a tumah taharah. Tumah taharah. So when she's sleeping, it's not negeiah. So the chiddush is, bein arah bein yeshanah, you should be bodek. But bizman hazeh that we anyway might not have taharos, who cares? The whole thing. That's right. So what do you want me to rip it? You want me to burn it? What do you want me to do? You don't know what you want me to do with this? Why, I shouldn't say it over? What? Next. Now, let's move along. You hear what's going on here? Now. The Tereshlam is not here. The Shulchan Aruch has to do with here. Right, so the Shulchan Aruch was talking about bedikos for taharos reasons. That's what it says. Now, the Gemara Niddah must be known in order to understand the entire halachah. So before we continue, I'll tell you the Gemara. The Gemara, daf yud beis, says that before tashmish—well, actually not before tashmish—an isha should not be bodek when living with her husband. Shema liboi naikvai. Because maybe when he looks, he's going to see that she's checking. It's going to give him palpitations. Liboi naikvai. Especially if you're from a Yid, you know, a real Charedi, he'll start shaking and it's going to turn into big problems, marital problems. Now, which bedikah? When bedikah are you referring to that you shouldn't be bodek when you live with your husband? So this is the machlokes Rishonim. Tosafos brings from the Rach, that's referring to before tashmish. Before tashmish you shouldn't be bodek. Shema liboi naikvai, and he won't do that tashmish. Then, what's so barur? It's machlokes Rishonim. Hagahos Maimoniyos brings from Rabbeinu Simcha, Rabbeinu Simcha, that it's talking about after, and shema liboi naikvai for the next time, because he's going to think, Oh, she sees after, she sees b'shas tashmish. Ooh, I better be very careful. She sees b'shas tashmish, I better be very careful. So liboi naikvai is for future. According to Hagahos Maimoniyos, Rabbeinu Simcha, what about before? Before? Faker, it's good, a mitzvah. It's a big mitzvah to be bodek, big mitzvah. The Rambam paskens, afilu isha sheyesh lo veses kavua, l'achar tashmish, bo'i bedikah. After tashmish, you should make a bedikah. Must, must make a bedikah. How about according to the Rambam, before? Don't say. The Rambam talks about after. So we could come and say, according to the Rambam, you don't have to. Or we could come and say that the Rambam means you shouldn't. Not clear. According to Rambam that says have to, after, how about before? Shouldn't, or doesn't have to? Which one is it? We're going to discuss this, and now we'll learn the Chaf. Says Meran, if she has a ves kavua, chalisha sheyesh la ves kavua, ba'alah shlo b'shaas vesta ve'eina tzricha bedikah lifnei tashmish. You don't need a bedikah lifnei tashmish. How about after? How about after? No? After you have to. If before you don't have to, the diyuk is that after you do have to. Notice, notice that he says you could. Tzricha bedikah, ve'eino tzricha bedikah. Could you? Mashma you could. So what it means is after, what, you have to. Before, eina tzricha, because if you learn in the Rambam, you could.

If you want to, so then the Mechaber is mamash the Rambam. Do you have the word Rambam there? Do you have the word Rambam there? Everybody does. I saw many Shulchan Aruchs that the word Rambam is not there. I saw many, many older versions of Shulchan Aruch that the word Rambam is not there. And you know why the word Rambam is not there? Okay. Do we pasken like this Rambam? Do we pasken like this Rambam? Does the Mechaber actually do pasken like this Rambam? The Rama argues, says, Haga, gam, gam, gam ein lo lehachmir livdok atzmo, lo lifnei tashmish v'lo l'achar tashmish. What kind of a lashon is gam? What are you talking about? Gam what? What do you mean, gam? Haga, gam ein—what do you mean, gam? Haga, cholek, not gam. What is gam? You're adding, you're subtracting. It's not gam! What's gam? Gam and also, also what? You said this and I say also. How is it gam? Torah Shleimim learns lo zeh v'lo zeh, exactly how he said it, beautifully, that the Rama is arguing on both points, which means you say have to after, and could before. I'm telling you shouldn't, shouldn't. You say have to after. Could before, I'm telling you, shouldn't, shouldn't. Should not, should not, should not. Hagah, eila, eila, eila, eila l'hachmir livdok atzma, lo lifnei, lo. L'hachmir? What kind of a lashon is l'hachmir? Chaburahs have to. You think if he held like the Ramban, it's l'hachmir? So if you're arguing directly on the Rambam, you shouldn't say gam, which is one diyuk that everybody makes. It should say, v'yesh omrim, I argue, v'yesh omrim, I hold differently. V'yesh omrim, I hold differently, right? The Rama should have said, v'yesh omrim, I argue. What is the word l'hachmir? Unless he means, you're saying chiyuv, I'm saying not even l'hachmir. In other words, you went to this extreme, I'm going to go and say gam to the other extreme, and you shouldn't even be machmir to do it. Hoi dilma, hoi dilma, or maybe even the Mechaber never says has to, but the Mechaber only talks about machmir to do it. Says the Rama, hagah, gam. When you said, v'ein tzricha bedikah lifnei tashmish al tzchumra, you would say maybe you should be machmir before, kamashmalan, eina tzricha, you don't have to be machmir. On this says the Rama, gam, you צריך להחמיר even after. Wow, it's a whole different Rama. You know this stuff? You know what I'm saying? That what he agrees with the Mechaber. That he's just adding, no, not only no tzricha, you shouldn't do it. And like the first way I said it. No, the first way I'm saying is that there's a tzricha for after. And he's saying is you shouldn't do it. So what do you have to be machmir? Just say, I hold you don't have to do it. So he wants to say, you go to one extreme, I'm going even you shouldn't even be machmir to do it. Now, I hold the Rama, Mechaber is wrong. You want to say, yes, I see not even to be machmir like the Mechaber. Right? That's how you learn it. O dilma, maybe we could say the Mechaber and the Rama. The Mechaber never said anything like the Rambam. There's no such thing. He says, ein tzricha bedikah lifnei tashmish. You don't need a bedikah lifnei tashmish. You shouldn't be sitting here, by the way, if you don't want this, you shouldn't sit here. Ve'ein tzricha bedikah lifnei tashmish, right? You don't have to be machmir lifnei tashmish. On this says the Rama, even after you don't have to be machmir according to the Mechaber, and they're not arguing. You know who says this? All the mefarshim in the back. There's a Yad Avraham, the mefarshim, Kafetz, everybody learns like this. And actually—

There's no machlokes. There's no mechaber here. It doesn't exist. There's no—it doesn't exist. What's the raya? What? How is it not machlokes? Because the Mechaber, funnily, never said when you have to. He just says when you don't have to. If you say like the Rambam, isn't it funny that the Rambam's paskening not in the Mechaber? You know, it's a strange thing that you're saying that he paskens like the Rambam, but it's not there. Ein tzricha bedikah lifnei tashmish. No, he should say, Tzricha bedikah achar tashmish. What would you say, what you do have to do, what you don't have to do? First you tell me what you have to do. Tzricha bedikah achar tashmish. You would say ein tzricha bedikah, and therefore make a diyuk, you mean lachar tashmish you have to? That makes sense to you? You know, according to the mefarshim, you got to cross out the Rambam here. Huh? No. Rambam says clearly you have to make bedikah. There's nothing saying it's wrong. That's not what it says. Are you listening? You know what I'm talking about? Hold it for me. Either we have a machlokes Mechaber-Rama, or we don't have a machlokes Mechaber-Rama. What we have is, as a matter of fact, joined together, buddy-buddy. Each one is saying, you know something? I want to explain to you the Mechaber. Gam, I want to explain to you what the Mechaber meant. I want to explain to you what the Mechaber meant. I have two rayas to this. Did you do the Beis Yosef? You saw in the Beis Yosef, yeah the Rambam or not the Rambam? What did you see in the Beis Yosef? Did he mention that he just brings the Rambam? Did he mention the Rov haPoskim? What does that sound like to you, that he holds that the Rambam is not the Rambam? So can I say that, or you want to say the shiur? You can say the shiur, I have no problem. You want to say the shiur, it's no problem. My second raya is, because the Mechaber himself says exactly, and he says, I don't hold of the Rambam. In siman kuf pei vav, se'if aleph. Who wants to read it? Okay, so that's it. What's the... There's nothing to talk about. I don't even know what the mefarshim on the page. They decide not to learn the Rambam later, I don't know. Huh? There's no other way to learn the Rambam. There's just no other way to learn it. The Rambam says— no, she'll swallow. Now. Huh? You don't understand what? Nothing. He says clearly, not the Rambam. There's nothing to understand. You say like the stam. There's nothing even to discuss. The meforshim that say Rambam, I have news for you: you have to cross it out. It's not true. He couldn't have paskened the Rambam because he paskens not like the Rambam. There's nothing. Huh? Who? What did he say? V'ein tzricha bedikah lifnei tashmish. No. V'ein tzricha bedikah, that even lifnei tashmish, which is even more, and you want to be machmir, there's a makom to be machmir, v'ein tzricha, you shouldn't be machmir. The reason why he's mentioning it— is this a pencil? Is this a pencil? Cross it out. Cross it out. Now.

Why do who say Rambam? Because the medayek, it means lifnei, and belacha you have to, and the medayek in the words. It's mashma it's the Rambam, but it's mashma can't overpower; he says pefurish. Okay. Now I'd like to point out, roiv. Roiv anashim yesh lahem vestes. What? No, but he says not like that. What do you mean? He says not like that. It's clearly. There's no way around this. And the Rambam was matzrich a bedikah. Yeah? When the Rambam was matzrich a bedikah on an isha sheyesh lo veses kavua. Yeah? On an isha that has a veses kavua. What was the metzius in the time of the Rambam? Let's say bizman hazeh, that an isha has a veses kavua, but roiv nashim... Don't have veset kavua. What happens in such a case? Clarity, I want to know. Bizman hazeh, in today's times, that the poskim tell us there's no such a thing as ro'iyos nashim yesh lahem veset kavua, okay? Does a veset kavua mean the same thing from the time when the ro'os nashim did have a veset kavua? I have another question. Does the bedikah have anything to do with the fact that it's ro'eh or not ro'eh, nashim yesh lahem veset kavua? Okay, let's discuss. Rema in the teshuvah says a tremendous chiddush. Rema in Igros Moshe, here, chelek Yoreh Deah siman yud-zayin—let's say chelek daled of Yoreh Deah siman yud-zayin, os chaf-ches—he says today we don't make bedikos. If you notice, the Mechaber, the Taz learns, aval shelo b'shaas tashmish, kol hamarbe livdok, harei ze meshubachas. Now, if you look at this, it's mashma also that b'shaas tashmish you shouldn't make bedikos, because if he meant afterwards you have to, so what does he mean, aval shelo b'shaas tashmish, kol hamarbe livdok harei ze meshubachas? But if you learn that it means never b'shaas tashmish, so you understand the Mechaber that says, aval shelo b'shaas tashmish, kol hamarbe livdok harei ze meshubachas. Hagam it's not 100% muchrach, because you could come and say— That you don't need a bedikah afterwards. I'm sorry, that you do need a bedikah afterwards, and that's have to. But shelo b'shaas tashmish, mishubachas. Okay. But if you learn it that you don't have to, shelo b'shaas tashmish, kol hamarbeh, b'livdok, harei zeh meshubachas. Does this apply today, or this only applies, rov hanashim yesh lahen vestes, rov nashim havestes, then there's an inyan to be bodek shelo b'shaas tashmish, kol hamarbeh, b'livdok, harei zeh meshubachas. R' Moshe in the teshuvah writes that today, women don't know the difference in colors. They don't know the difference in colors, and therefore there's no inyan of being bodek kol hamarbeh, b'livdok, because it just turns into problems. There was a time where there was a kvius; we knew colors, we knew right from wrong, tahor from tamei, k'dai. It's a sheva, but today we're all problematic. So R' Moshe just discusses that there would be no ma'alah, only a chisaron. So you want to come out with ma'alos, it'll come out more kilkul than ma'alah. It'll come out more kilkul than ma'alah, right?

That’s what Remoisha says. I would like to ask maybe something else. Maybe the inyan of checking for bedikas was kol zman roiv nashim yesh lahem veses kavua. But this zman hazeh that there’s anyway no kvius for the vestes, maybe since you’re not kavua not to see, so then it wouldn’t be just mishubachas. Maybe you would have to. The Rama says, roiv nashim yesh lahem veses kavua. Comes along the Meramani, says, hagah, ein lehachmir livdok atzmah. Maybe that’s only because roiv nashim yesh lahem veses kavua. But bizman hazeh that roiv nashim don’t have a veses kavua, maybe you should be bodek. I started off the shiur this way. I want to know, is this halacha dependent on the fact that it’s roiv, or it has nothing to do with roiv? I also asked you, do you need to be nikva not to have a veses kavua in order to come and say that, you know what, you don’t have to check? Remember, kol zman shei wasn’t nikva to have a veses kavua, right, then you do have to check, even toch lamed of the ona beinonis. Maybe when it’s not roiv nashim yesh lahem veses kavua, the whole seif doesn’t apply the other way. Maybe you’re mechuyav to check, even if she’s kavua. It wasn't the only. That's a shaila here, yeah? What is that called, chazakah? What is that? What's what called? No, no. Since there was such a thing called roiv nashim hada kvius, mimeila we could come and say that sheloi b'shaas their kvius, it meant something, and therefore you don't have to check. But it could be today, since roiv nashim are not kavua. So what does that mean, roiv nashim are not kavua? The not kavua is the taich that even after they're kovea, l'maaseh there's no such a thing as a kvius a hundred percent. Or when the women are kavua, it's taka a hundred percent. I'm venturing into, rabosai, very, very murky waters, big sugyas, which I don't have time for right now. I obviously can't even go there now. But again, I'm just trying to show you that today the sif doesn't apply for certain reasons, like R' Moshe writes. I'm showing you that it might not apply for other reasons also. Roiv nashim yesh lahem veses kavua, so in that halacha, says the Rama, you're not mechuyiv to be bodek sheloi b'shaas veses. Why am I saying this? Because I saw the Mechaber later that says that even if eina beinis is called a kvius veses, but kol zman she's not kavua not to see, she still has to be bodek. I, eina beinis is a kvius veses. See, if you learn like the Rambam, that it's not a kvius veses. It's just, lo olam loy tira, sanacha nami. You don't have a raya from that Gemara. But if you learn like the Raz, that it's called a kvius vest, so why do you need also that she should be kovea not to see? We're going to learn later on that there's two types of kvius. There's kvius when yes to see, and then there's kvius when not to see. Does the date on the calendar depend on both or one? Do I need a kvius yes to see, or a kvius yes to see and those days a kvius not to see? You like it? You know what I'm talking about? I don't want to go further for one simple reason, because most of the olam is almost lost, if they're not already lost, and if I go one step further, everybody's going to be lost. So I want to stop right here, but I just want to point out this nekudah, that R' Moshe learns, kol hamarkel livdok doesn't apply today at all, and as a matter of fact, better not to be bodek b'zman hazeh. If you want to know harei ze meshubachas, it's not to be bodek, because it's just sefek yotza lidei kilkulim. Another thing I want to point out, an interesting halacha, that if let's say you don't hold like R' Moshe...

Let's say you want to makel amar b'livdik. Does that apply to the wipings that women do after they do their tzrach? So l'choira, if you learn like this mechaber, kol hamarbeh livdok, so she should check. She should always keep on guard. Shevet HaLevi in the teshuvos says this is not what the mechaber is referring to, because livdok, that's not a bedikah. That's not going to help you anyway for a bedikah. Memeila, fakert, kol hamarbeh shelo livdok, and that would apply, which means even if you want to be machmir like this mechaber, throw away the papers. Don't look. The best thing is not to look. It's not an eitz. This is not called an eitz habad. It's not what's negea for the badik. You missed the point. The point is according to the mechaber that says kol hamarbeh livdok, so maybe use this kol hamarbeh livdok. Check. You want to be clean constantly, make sure, and be on the safe side, so l'choira you want to have a good—check every time there's a toilet paper, check. He says a chiddush that kol hamarbeh livdok, because you could—R' Moshe is saying that kol hamarbeh livdok klal doesn't apply b'zman hazeh. But he's saying a chiddush. Let's say you hold it does apply b'zman hazeh, which most poskim would say that it does apply. Why not? Kol hamarbeh livdok, it's, I mean, l'choira you're doing away with the whole mechaber. He says, but that's only kol hamarbeh livdok, but not when it comes to the tissue papers, because that's not called badik. That's called kinuach, and it's not included. Why? So let's cheshbon it out. I was thinking about it. Why not? I mean, it gives you— It gives you a chance to check. So what? But if you see that there's trouble, so then go make a bedikah. I mean, whatever it is, let's say you check, right, and there's something wrong, so then you go make a bedikah. Huh? Because you want to be marbeh livdok to make sure there's nothing, so keep on checking. Be a frummer. Be a frummer, no? No, I'm telling you, you know what you get? What you get is you get the mitzvah of checking what's going on. Like this, you know that something's wrong, so go check again. So she checks her underwear every few minutes, that's called mishubachas? That's what he wants to say, marbeh kavart. He's trying to say, so you know what? Should a woman go around checking her underwear every five, every half hour? So he's trying to say that's not what it meant, this halachah. He's trying to say, marbeh chidush. In other words, when someone reads this mechaber, you know what you would say? You know what, have the lady make herself crazy every half hour because she wants to be frum. So he wants to say a marbeh chidush, that the word livdok means not to be bodek, but livdok means to do a ma'aseh bedikah. Let me tell you something. If you didn't learn the mechaber this way, you would have women who are mamash going crazy, especially in Eretz Yisrael, Yerushalayim, and Mea Shearim. It would be nonstop. So he wants to say that kol amar livdok means to be bodek. You don't have to constantly worry maybe. That's not what he wants to say. You have to constantly go do ma'aseh bedikos. Let me ask you a question. What's called a maaseh b'dikah? Every second? Every half hour? What's called a maaseh? You know, by hefsek taharah, technically you can make one bedikah after another. Chazon Ish holds not like that. Chazon Ish holds that every bedikah, in order to be a shem bedikah, you had to give it enough time that it's not clean from the old bedikah. But even that is only a few minutes. Kol hamar b'livdok, harei ze meshubachas. Is it every hour? Is it three times a day? Is it twice a day? Maybe for shivah nekiyim it's enough twice a day. So kol hamar b'livdok, maybe it's that. I don't know, I never saw anybody talk about this. You're a posek, no? Or you're not a posek? You know what, you tell me. For the Rav, Ila, Moreinu HaRav Ila, mar b'livdok. Ishti rotzah lihyot... Okay, tell me. Tell me, no? What's kol hamar b'livdok? She should be checking her underwear every twenty minutes. She should be looking at her toilet papers.

You know what? Maybe she should do something else. She should wear a pit like this. If she catches anything. But maybe she's mechuyev to make bedikos every half hour. Maybe it's only twice a day. Maybe it's only twice a day, like the shivah nekiyim. So I have here a Rema. It tells me, forget about bedikos; the whole mechaber doesn't apply. Okay, so Baruch Hashem, Rema says not to pay attention to this. Okay. But if you learn that it does apply here, you know what I understood for a Rema? I'll tell you what I understood for a Rema. Hello? Hello. You know what I understood for a Rema? That the kol amar b'livdok is not so much to find caution if there's something there, but kol amar b'livdok, tahor tamei. It's not kol amar b'livdok, go find maybe there's going to be something, maybe she's a period starting, maybe — that's not what he means. Either you're tamei or tahor, because we're not going to know the answer anyway, so the kol amar b'livdok is not נוגע. That's what he wants to say. Since it's a safek anyway, it's not נוגע. But if you learn that it means to worry that there's something there, maybe she should worry all day long. She should be checking, she should be putting pads there. Or maybe it's not more than shivah nekiyim, maybe it's only twice a day. I'm going to stop right here, okay? I gave you the information that you need to understand the seif. I have a lot of chiddushim here, but I don't think the olam is going to be able to survive it, so we'll stop it right here. We learned the Torah Shleimah, we learned the Taz, we learned the Shach, we learned the Yad Avraham, we did everything, the Rambam, Rishonim, this is the seif. And then I want you just to be mechadesh to me, what does it mean kol amar b'livdok.