Hilchos Vestos: Poked Es Ishto Before Travel—Divrei Ritzui, Chibuk V’Nishuk, and Prishah

Transcript

Sorry. Mikam makoi d'Rama. Mikam makoi, hamachmir shelo lifkod rak b'divrei ritzui, tavoi alav bracha. Now, it's interesting, the words of the Rama is actually divrei ritzui. You can't run away from the words of the Rama. Chibuk v'nishuk is not divrei ritzui. Divrei doesn't mean words; it means matters of ritzui, even ... Is that the simple translation? The simple translation of divrei ritzui means divrei ritzui, words of ritzui. So be'emes, the Shach comes along and says, Divrei ritzui, divrei ritzui. Oh, I had a different Shach yesterday, so I'm off on the—where is it? Come on. No, where is it? Not Chavav. It's a Taz. No, wait. Yeah, Tet-vav, divrei ritzui. No, no, no, no. We learned the Shach yesterday. It means even chibuk v'nishuk. Chavzayin. Yeah, Chaf-zayin. You know what it is? I had yesterday the other one, the Bach here, and it's on the bottom, so I keep on looking for it over here. It's actually, you know, okay, whatever. It's by you; the Bach is on the bottom over there. Chafinei kirva, afilu chibuk v'nishuk. Afilu—oh, mikol makom, hamachmir shelo lifkod rak b'divrei ritzui, tavoi alav bracha. Okay. So the shailah is like this. It says the Taz, Af al gav degam b'ein yotzei l'derech shari, it's anyway mutar, divrei Ritzki l'sif beis, mikol makom, b'yotzei l'derech chayav b'ka. He's chayav. Now the emes is, in seif katan gimmel, the Taz himself paskens that it's taka asur b'chibuk v'nishuk, even shelo yotzei l'derech. I mean, saying by shelo yotzei l'derech, right? Seif katan gimmel, everybody has it? One second. Yeah. I know, I know, one second. Here, Taz, right? I'm getting confused with my other... I got you three other ones. Okay. Here. V'loy meshakreivis, kasav afilu chibuk v'nishuk mutar, l'hachshilo biya, keivan shebi'ah asurah miderabanan, l'kach shetesh... shekasav les meiz... kasav Mar Yechami, hamachabezes tavel l'bracha, v'li nireh she'asur min hadin chibuk v'nishuk, l'daas haRosh. V'Rayah mi... kasav haRosh... it is asur, right? So then when the Taz comes along and says, Af al gav degam ben Yisrol derech shari, he must have meant divrei. That's the machlokes. The beis is a machlokes, the shach and the Taz. According to the Shach, it's mutar even chibah v'nishuk. And according to the Taz, it's only mutar, what? B'divrei ritzui. Ah, it's mamish mutar anyway, and the teretz is chayav. You become chayav to do this. You're chayav for, meaning you're chayav in ones with divrei ritzui. What's your question? What's the shaylah? Slow, slow, slow, slow. I don't understand. It's a pashut. It's like a stirah in the Taz. The Shach himself says that when we come matir, we're matir all kreivos, meaning chibah v'nishuk. In the Rama, the Rama just says divrei ritzui. The Taz, when quoting the Rama, says it's mutar b'divrei ritzui anyway, so the teretz is you're chayav. Yeah, but it's not—

Not mutar anyway with divrei ritzui. He holds it's asur min hadin, so obviously he couldn't have meant that, right? The Acharonim, Levush, all the back Acharonim, they say the pshat is divrei ritzui. He doesn't mean chibah v'nishuk, and there is a machlokes. So if someone asks you on a test, is it mutar, the chibah v'nishuk? Machlokes. Machlokes the Taz and the... But doesn't the Taz in seif katan gimmel say that it's mutar, chibuk v'nishuk? Oh, that's nice. I don't know. Maybe you have a different Taz than I have. The Taz says it's asur min hadin. But that's the Rosh, and he holds like that. Now, if you take a look... Could you function as a shiur? Let's function, please. Okay. Now let's take a look over here. לעניין שיש להחמיר בחיבוק ונישוק, שמא יבוא לידי חשק. והוא הדין נמי הכא. כל שכן הוא דיש לחוש פן יהלך לדרך. Chayra, and it makes sense, because it's a kol shekein, heylech לדרך, that there's cheshek, and therefore it's asur. So therefore we have to say divrei ritzui. That is one way how to learn the Shach, the Taz. The Nesivos doesn't learn it that way. The Chavas Daas over here on seif katan gimmel doesn't learn it that way. The Chavas Daas says, No. Nope. It's taka mutar. And the biggest raya is because the Taz says divrei ritzui is mutar, and he learned that the word divrei ritzui is like the Shach. That it means, ... I says that it's aser, and the teretz is, it's aser k'she'eino yotzei l'derech, and it's mutar. I says, v'kol shekein hu d'yesh lo cheshik tfei. It's a kol shekein, meaning that since there is a cheshik k'sheyotzei l'derech, and we're matir it, asur b'falzulei when it's not yotzei l'derech, and therefore for sure we should aser it. Again, our Taz is saying it's mutar, period, if sheyotzei l'derech. My chiddush? I would taste stuff like this? You gotta be kimi. You should run me out of town if I taste stuff like this. This is the Chavos Daas. I'm the sefer. ... Chavos Daas. Look it up, Chavos Daas. You know this? You know there's a peltige zach. Tell me you're cheating books didn't bring it. ... Because my understanding, the Taz in sif katan ... it's mashma, the gam b'ein yotzei l'derech shari. What is he talking about? According to the Chavos Daas, it's not aser. It's aser only b'shas ... not b'yotzei l'derech. I, he says the words kol shekein. Right, they're magiah. They're magiah in the Taz. Fine, I'm saying the point is, over there the regular not yotzei l'derech aser ... That's right, that's right. What about the fact that he says over here, d'af al gav d'gam b'ein yotzei l'derech shari, but here it's chayav. What is he talking about? Let the Chavos Daas do it. Sorry not to read the Taz. You saw this? You saw the... It's the ... on the side. They have it here on the side. Also, everybody look at it on the side here. Telaimar. Oh, he has his tack over here. All right, so read it. Who wants to read that ... on the side? Telaimar. This is part of the Shulchan. ... This is ... The ... cheshek ... This is ... kivan shemutar k'sheholech l'derech. ... This is ... kivan shekilu bo ... ... He says, if ... k'sheholech l'derech, then it's mutar. Then it's mutar ... l'derech, but stam it's ... mutar.

What? Over here it says mutar. I thought in the ein yotzei l'derech sharim b'divrei. I thought you fixed them both. I thought you want to fix them both. That's why you put the hagah here. I thought you fixed it here also. I was under the impression that we should fix it here too. Yeah, I mean, there's two parts to the kasha. One is the din, and the other one is the words. Loychiach, one from another, one words in the Tosafos. Okay, so let's—you know what we're talking about l'maaseh, maskana l'maaseh. Someone asks you the test: chibur v'nishuk mutar, and the answer is, according to the Shach, it's mutar. According to the Taz, it depends how you read the Taz. Either you read the Taz that it's only if you use mutar, or you read the Taz that what? Chibur v'nishuk is mutar. Okay? Now, chibur v'nishuk is aser when it's not k'sheyotzei l'derech. Mashenkein k'sheyotzei l'derech, that chibur v'nishuk is mutar. So that's your pashut kasha. What's the reason why chibur v'nishuk is aser on the yayin? The teretz is—yeah, right. So why would it be mutar? Why? How? How can it be mutar? How can something be mutar? You want to explain to me. How does yotzei l'derech change? Somebody kasha. I mean, it's a real shash. We're worried about some— Again, maybe the people that aser, their matir tashmish b'yotzei l'derech, how can you be matir tashmish? Why is it different than a regular shash? Because hein gazru, hein gazru. They said that you're not allowed to do it b'shaas. Now they're telling you that over here it's mutar. I agree with you, but I understood that the second side is asering tashmish. Right, so the same way that they ask a ... initially there, they can ... Again, according to the second tzad in the Rama, we're worried. Tashmish is actually asur. And what's the reason why tashmish is asur? Because we're afraid, right? So why are we not afraid over here? And the teretz is what? I want to know what the teretz is. The same chazakah could be asking. Huh? Why are you asking tashmish? Control עצמו. Why is it mutar? Why is tashmish ...? Because shema yavo lidei tashmish. Okay, so yavo lidei tashmish, still she won't see. Two ... There's so many steps separating that from the actual chashash of re'iyah. According to the second tzad, we're afraid of something, right? Even the first tzad, you have to ... I don't know. From the metzius to answer you on the ... No, but the first tzad is the ... You mean on a regular ...? No, but the second tzad ... So I'll tell you what. If someone says it's a chashash ... what do you have to worry about? So over here also it's a chashash. But again, what you're asking is ... You need ... to be ... right? You have to say. So on a regular day he doesn't care, so even if I'm here, then I can rent. But when I'm ... I'm too scared to use my power, so I'm not choshesh about chibuv nishuk that I'll be going to tashmish. So it's an answer from metzius, so no psychological answer. No, it's like exactly what you just said. Why now we're not choshesh to tashmish, so then in chibuv and yichud we can say a different type of answer. And we just said that it's worse. Aren't we machmir that much worse? There's more ... it's much worse. I'm not sure, I get the whole halachah. The bishlama you say it's not worse. So maybe the pshat is because it's worse. On a regular time, right, that it's not— I mean, I could hear your shtikel Torah and say like this: on a regular day, it's whatever it is, and af al pi kein yotzei l'derech would became, don't worry about it. But if the cheshik is worse— sometimes, what is the svara? So what's pshat in all these halachos? I don't get the whole— If you tell me the cheshik is worse and the chashash is real, then I don't get the whole story. So how could anybody be matir tashmish? By you, teiman u'veheima. But no, but how can you be matir? Who was posek to matir tashmish on that? Who was posek to what? To be matir tashmish. Who? I'm asking you, I don't know. That's all the same question. All I'm asking you is like this. No, no, it's not just a question. No, no, you're just telling the part right now. I'll explain to you what I want. In two seconds, exactly. You know, I think when you read that shach, you know what I think that shach is interesting. I mean, that Taz is very interesting. That Taz is that this will come lizlzuli to something else. It's a whole new way of understanding derabbanan, no? Is it possible—

That there's a whole new avenue of understanding veses d'rabbanan in this Tos. According to Chavos Daas, the way he learns up, right, he says it has to do with zilzul, right? So the kol shekein aser, which is mid'rabbanan, he's going on top of the d'oraisa. The kol shekein, which we should come in out—we don't mean the d'oraisa, we mean kol shekein the sevara should be aser. For what reason? Because it'll be aser l'zolzulei on a regular time, right? So is it about that? Is every veses d'rabbanan about because then you'll come to be meikel on regular niddah? Is that possible? I see, in what? No, but again, I'm asking a simple question. Are we afraid—I just want to know—are we afraid to stop bleeding while he's with her? I just want to know if that's what it's about. Right, so after the Taz, you learned the Taz, the kol shekein, I want to know what's kol shekein. Kol shekein what? What does that have to do with the cheshik part? That I don't get. Explain to me where the cheshik part comes in, wherefore he won't be able to control himself. Is that what it's about? I want to know what the kol shekein. You know what? Do me a big favor. Look at the Chavos Daas and read it to me. You know what? I'm not moving till you read that Chavos Daas. I'm not interested in anybody's pshat. Just read it to me. Look at the Chavos Daas, se'if katan beis. The kol shekein hacha, d'yesh bo cheshesh tfei, keivan shemutar k'sha'eilah l'derech. Here, cheshesh tfei, not there. Okay, here it's cheshesh tfei, not here. So what's the kol shekein? Since it's mutar in other places, and here it's cheshesh tfei, it's going to be asur. Here. Again, the cheshesh tfei is where? Here, in the regular eino yotzei l'derech. No! Hey! You need to be put in the corner. What are you saying? I'm reading again. Kol shekein hacha, hacha here. Yeah. Why? D'yesh bo cheshesh tfei, keivan shemutar k'sha'eilah... But he's going on the kol shekein b'yotzei l'derech. He's going back on the kol shekein hacha of the case. I don't want to argue with Rebbe. I'm going to read it, I'm going to say the same thing. He's arguing, he's going here. It's going on now. It's going on now. Kol shekein hacha d'yesh cheshesh tfei, keivan shemutar... Okay, you know what? Okay, so let's think the way you're saying. What's the cheshesh tfei? Because it's mutar k'sha'eilah l'derech. You want to explain what that means? Just translate those. Because the person sees, ah, this kula is regarding this matter. So as I said, it comes out that the issur vest, there's a cheshbon, lo l'zalzulei b'fnimiyus. This cheshbon, I don't know, it's a scary thing. When I read it, I start to shake. I don't know, it's a whole new thing of understanding vest d'Rabbanan. Are we worried that any woman will start bleeding, or we want to say, listen, Rabbi, a person is going to come and start doing aveiros because it's mutar in certain cases? It's not a strange thing. Kol shekein hacha. Sham, yeah. Sham there. Where is he going on? Tash, kuf, beis. Ois ... b'chibuk, v'yesh ta'am ... tash, kuf, beis. So that's ... sham. ... למה זה ... יש לו היתר ... Because there's a special chumra in vestes d'Rabbanan because there is a heter in vestes d'Rabbanan. Tashmis is because she might ... because you're going to be mezalzel in the tashmish. ... Yeah, I don't know. It's dependent on ... you have to know. I hope you have to know. What's bothering me is it comes out that if there's an issur of chibuk v'nishuk, it might have to do with the fact that since there's once in a while a heter, therefore the Rabbanan made a gezeirah ... Right. Again, what was the ... In other words, if it wasn't for this heter of ... it would have been a ... I mean, it's a strange halacha. So then it comes out, ... right, that you know what the heter, why chibuk v'nishuk is taka mutar ...

Because it is mutar. Because even... technically it is. Because the whole reason was because of... The whole reason why we asked in any other place, because here we were not, because here it's ... But in reality, it doesn't make any sense. No, not at all. If it's really mutar by ... then we just asked because of that, then where does it start? Exactly. That's where I don't... that's where I want. Now you'll see what I wanted. I read this ... last night, and I said, you know something, I don't... sometimes a normal person can't comprehend. It's always mutar. It's always mutar. It's mutar here and mutar there, and then they asked it here because of there. Because they asked it there. In other words, a regular ... should have been mutar. We asked it because we gave you a heter there, but it really was a heter in the first place. That's right. ... That's why. ... because tashmish is mutar by ... That's why. Whatever it is, is it mutar, yes or no? I don't think about it. It's because tashmish is mutar, but ... That's why. You said that tashmish is mutar, but ... That's why also ... maybe not like this. Maybe that ... maybe that ... tremendous chiddush, according to him, in the ... chibuk v'nishuk, because it's mutar ... And you know why it's mutar? Because it is mutar. In other words, in other words, in other words, being that tashmish d'mittah is one location, therefore we answered even chibuk v'nishuk in another location. Why? I would have smira. I just smira. I should be that one. Because otherwise someone would be like, Ah, tashmish... I don't know if he's right. What's the regular...? We machmir one prat in aveilus, you shouldn't forget it in aveilus. It's here. Tashmish, the ikar hadin is only tashmish should be asur by regular. And tashmish should be asur by yichud. I'm telling you, since tashmish is mutar here, you wouldn't make a gezeirah by tashmish here also. What else is mutar by... Not true. What do you mean? Only divrei is mutar. What are you talking about? How is that? Who said that? It's true. What do you mean? That's what the... The Rama is telling the meikel, the only thing there is only... I mean, the sevara is starting from the words of the Taz over here. Where's the sevara? The sevara comes from here. The words here, when it says, kol shekein... it's because over there it's mutar by tashmish. Because it's mutar by tashmish, asal l'zalzuli over here by tashmish, so they made a chizuk that even chibuk v'nishuk is asur. Okay, now listen carefully. This is the chavos daas, yel chazor. Listen carefully. Listen to what I want. Yeah, you with me? Chiddush. Interesting? Interesting. Okay. Can we close it? They closed it. They live in the... ...found the cult. He says the word tashmis? No, we're reading between the lines. I'm not so convinced. Are you convinced? I see both ways, but I'm not machria. Okay.

Otherwise, I mean, the chavah doesn't make sense. Why? This should make sense. What do you mean? If chibuk v'nishuk is always mutar, and then we're matir b'yetzer, so we're asering it here. This doesn't make sense. It has to be that they have to put an extra chumra over there. What would be the zilzuli before this? It would be mezalzel in tashmish. Before we say chibuk v'nishuk was mutar before, so what are they going to be mezalzel in? They're not going to be mezalzel. Okay, let's see further. Okay. So according to one shita, chibuk v'nishuk is mutar. According to one shita, chibuk v'nishuk is asur. And then in the Shach, chibuk v'nishuk is chiyuv or it's just mutar? V'chol minei kirvah, afilu chibuk v'nishuk. V'af gav d'kasavti l'il se'if kan b'shem haBach, d'mamach chibuk v'nishuk kasav l'brach, nir'eh d'hacha ein lehachmir klal. Chiyuv? Chiyuv? Huh? K'var nitba'er. To whom? K'var nitba'er before. To whom? No, k'var nitba'er the halacha, nu, chav-zayin. Yeah, I know, but it means like— K'var nitba'er. He's already brought it, he brought it. K'var nitba'er. So he needs to pull out. I want to know when the ... when he says, Ein lehachmir klal, does it mean chiyuv? Mimeila now it's a chiyuv? Or the pshat is, ein lehachmir klal, we can't ask. There's no reason to be machmir. And mimeila, I want to know when he says that this is, Ein lehachmir klal, it's optional. What would you say? Pashut chiyuv. No, I mean if it's because... I see both. Let me tell you what I want. There's something going through my mind, and I want to tell you what's going through my mind. Ready? We can soon learn in the Pischei Teshuva that yotzei l'derech is completely different than any other dvar mitzvah. There's a special heter for yotzei l'derech. You saw the Pischei Teshuva? Okay, let's do it inside. Right, Choshen... okay, go ahead, read it inside. Nu? Which one? It doesn't matter. Why does it matter? Okay, go ahead, yeah. Iyun teshuvas Knesses Yechezkel. Everybody look inside. Iyun teshuvas Knesses Yechezkel. Okay, so this is a machloikes if it's every leil tefillah or dafka only yotzei l'derech. Baalei teshuvah give a shailah. ... l'veses ... daf heicha davar ... ... kitzur gives you the case how it's possible, right? How is it possible that it should be veses? I don't see what she's sick, and the answer is, yeah, whatever, that her veses is that way. He goes through the numbers, okay? ... pasuk ... What's the machloikes? What are they arguing? What's the machloikes? Mitzvahs mitzvah, no? Mitzvahs, mitzvah. I don't remember where I saw this, but I remember the Rishonim. There's a special heter of yotzei l'derech shelo l'tznius. I saw it some years ago. I saw it. I didn't have time to look again, but I remember seeing it somewhere, that there's a special svara of yotzei l'derech shelo l'tznius.

She, sheloy tisnah. When she's around and she's anyway not going to be mezaneh, there's no heter of leil tefillah. It's not mitzvah. Not that it's a mitzvah, but it's sheloy tizneh. You hear? You listening? But what's the chiluk between every leil? Every leil tefillah is a mitzvah. The teretz is, we're only matir what? We're only matir because shema tizneh. Maybe she'll be mezaneh. What? It's the way her vest is. Whatever, lamed, yud aleph, it works out. She's a shtickel. She's a shtickel. That's what's... Okay. Let me ask you another question. There's something unique about this siman, hayotzei l'derech. You know what's unique about this siman, hayotzei l'derech? Because if you hold it's every leil mitzvah, and ein hachanami, so say whenever there's a mitzvah, talk about leil tefillah, talk about a kallah. Why do you talk about yotzei l'derech, and from there you have to learn out leil tefillah? You know, I think there's another yesod here. You ready? Another what? Another yesod here. Hayotzei l'derech is always... Is it monthly, every month he goes? Or hayotzei l'derech, it happens. You notice he brings two cases. He brings two cases: I am a teshuvas Knesses Yechezkel, d'im ira le'el tefillah mikesem, mikesem samuch l'vesta. Im ira le'el tefillah mikeses samuch l'vesta. Why does he talk about im ira, mikesem? So pashut pshat is because the case is otherwise very weird. Like everybody's asking, what is she here, huh? And then he says, no, some say even if it's constantly that way, tiga'nisha sheyesh la veses kavua milamed lamed yom. So the way you learn this machlokes is, it's about, it's not a normal case, right? What does that mean? The case of yotzei l'derech is not normal? No, this—he's saying some say it's only mikesem, and some say it's miriah lama. What are they arguing, a metzius of cases, or that's the shaila of cases? Pashut they're arguing—you asked this kasha, right?—pashut they're arguing, saying it's a weird case, the second case. Wait a minute, something scares me. When I say weird, you know what? That goes through my mind. Either they're arguing, pashut, because it's a weird case, therefore why talk about weird cases? I dilma maybe the chachamim were not mesaken on an ira, on a crazy case, where it's kavua, where it's constant, it's different. And there's two ways how to learn constant is different. Either the constant is different because the gezeirah is only on milsa d'shchicha. It's only on a milsa d'lo שכיחא, we're not gozer, and if what happens, it's a milsa d'lo שכיחא, it happens. But if it's a constant thing, maybe that's called a milsa d'shchicha, meaning it's not a milsa d'lo שכיחא; it's not a thing that just happens. Like Dilma, since the whole metzius is a milsa d'lo שכיחא, such a case that she has this, so she's a story of milsa d'lo שכיחא. Dilma, the pshat is that chachamim weren't going to be matkia the sugya vestes for a particular girl all her life. Listen, every month it's this way, and therefore it has to be eira. So nafka mina would be a yotzei l'derech. Let's say it's a yotzei l'derech monthly with a kvius. That would be תלוי in this shaila. Now let me say again what I just said. I do have a lot of information. Truthfully, I see when I'm talking, it's probably my fault. For some reason I'm מבולבל today, I don't know why. My mind isn't organized the way it's supposed to be. Maybe I'm thirsty, I'm hungry, something's wrong. I'm not—well, maybe I'm thirsty, I don't know what it is. I'm not organized today, but I'm saying beautiful things, by the way. If you follow with me, you'll realize that I'm really saying beautiful. It's a beautiful pshat. In other words, like this: היוצא לדרך. Remember yesterday I asked you this question: היוצא לדרך, I mean, mitzvah, not mitzvah, yeah mitzvah, what's the story of yotzei, and then he brings down later.

He says a case: Dem hoyl chadvar mitzvah, ein tzarich lifkod ishtoi bechlal. In general, right? But this has nothing to do with vestos. But the sugya of vestos is in a story of hayotzei l'derech, right? Is it pshat that it's a mitzvah, it's a chiyuv, is hayotzei l'derech even d'var reshus, right? So then they bring a case: shepasak, im ira leil tevilasah mikesem, samuch l'vestah, mutar gam kein. Okay? It's mutar. V'hu habehaitev, sif katan yud-daled, kvar cholku haAcharonim. So first of all, what's the machlokes? What are they arguing? Meaning, it could be it's only by yotzei l'derech. Why should it only be by yotzei l'derech? So the truth is, many mefarshim learn, so whatever, I don't remember where I saw it, but the Rishonim say because by tis, there's a sevara of shema tis. So therefore they defeat the purpose by making a gezeirah. They defeat the purpose. It's not every leil tevilah. It's not about leil tevilah; it's about having to be makpid. Then he brings a second thing from the תשובת גבעת שאול, that even by a vest kavua, which comes out every leil tevilah, which comes out on the vest. What are they arguing? The answer is one is giving you a zach case and one is giving you a zach case. Oy dilma, it could be there's a taich. The first צד holds that ir, it has to be something that happens. It can't be something constant. Peirush, because the reason why the Rabbanan said by yotzei l'derech there's no issur, no sugya of vest, is because it's a milsa d'lo shchicha. It's circumstances such that we have to be matir. It's a circumstance story, okay? Hasheinkeit, if it's a constant thing, it may be different. Oy dilma the pshat is, we're not going to come and take a woman who every month is that way and say there's no sugya vestos. I know. So what? But could be that's the heter of the machlokes. I'm saying. So I'm asking you, what happens if a person weekly—weekly—he sets up that, I'm sorry, monthly, he sets up this trip that should come out סמוך לוסת? Huh? What happens in such a case? Now let me tell you a kasha that Rav Chaim ... asked. Rav Chaim ... asked a kasha. Every time you live with your wife, it's a דבר מצוה, yeah? When is it דבר מצוה? We said that if you're going with דבר מצוה, you're not mechuyav. Why is this mitzvah more important than this one? You ask me a kasha. Huh? What's the mitzvah there is? What happens? This is a mitzvah there. Every day is. Huh? This only came about because I had to go. How is it more? You mean the first other mitzvah you're going with is there? No, it's just like this. Here. ויש אומרים, שאם אדם רוצה לילך לדרך, ואם הולך דבר מצוה, אין צריך לפקוד אשתו, right? If he has to go l'dvar mitzvah, he's not mechuyav. Ah, so you're saying a vart. You say since the whole mitzvah started— Because I go away. I'm already oisek in that mitzvah. Now comes the one before that. I'm already oisek. But you're not oisek b'mitzvah over there; you go there. No, maybe—whatever day that day, that day she already makes preparation beforehand. She was not mishtokek; had I not left. You hear what he's saying? You hear what he's doing? You hear what he's answering? But since the mechayev comes from here, because you're going l'derech, and that l'derech is l'mitzvah, so meileh the mechayev isn't. I would say it a little different. How would I say? I have a yesod. I hold it's a true yesod. The chiyuv onah, the chiyuv onah is kefi your lifestyle. You see this, the payalim have a certain onah, the talmid chacham has a different onah. Since there's a halacha you're supposed to go lidvar mitzvah, there's no chiyuv onah. You don't need that. Who says anything about mitzvah? Over here, by this case? He says it over here. You have a Rashi that says over here. Over here in Yevamos, one is mitzri that he's not going to do the mitzvah at all, and one is mitzri that he... One is mitzri that he won't do the mitzvah, so what's the ptur? Because he's going to be mitbatel from the mitzvah he's going... Yeah, again, but again, but you...

Tell me, I missed. I want to — you saw the words, ois mitzvah, patur min hamitzvah? Thank you. That's what I'm trying to get. You know what the word is? You're proving what I'm saying. No, see that — you're not doing that. That's right. That's exactly what I said. Oh, you know, it's not the type that is supposed to stop you from what you have to do. Why does it stop you? You don't have to do it. You don't have to. ... Oh, you see, now you're playing games. You know yourself that I spoke out yesterday that maybe that's not called a dvar reshus. I can tell according to me. That's what I'm getting at. I'm getting at the word reshus. Hayah yoshev l'derech. What do you call reshus? Reshus patur from mitzvah, and then you have to go on to the sugya of ois mitzvah patur min hamitzvah? Or reshus means — sometimes you don't need to do it. No one asks you to do it. Right. This is Rashi. I didn't know this was Rashi. So let me start by telling you first of all that this is a likutei. The Rashi, by the way, is going on the second part. Shema yarch imo b'reitzuim v'yisbatel min hamitzvah. Okay? Now bring me the Gemara Yevamos, and let's see it inside, okay? And we'll see how Rashi... I'm oisek b'mitzvah. My wife understood, I don't have to do anything, I have to ignore... What, what, what? ... I'm inna. That's what Talmidei Chachamim only have a one-two-one week. Maybe ... Because when you're busy with something else, you don't do it. Only once a week. That's your license. I can't. She has a problem, okay, so I said you're not going to work anymore. That's the ... I'm asking you, don't ask me. Okay. Yevamis, samech beis amud beis. What if he's busy on Friday night also? Family on Friday night. Shabbos. Family. No, אין ... Yeah, beautiful. Yes, exactly. There's no Rashi ... I stand corrected. I told you. There's no such thing. I know the whole world writes the way he wrote. There's no such Rashi. It's not there. It's not there. Rashi says. I'm telling you, because he uses thinking. He uses something went through my mind. I don't believe in a ... Our job, a wife cannot come and say, You owe me. I don't owe you. I'm busy with something. I don't owe you. I'm busy. I don't know why not, because that's the way the chiyuv onah works. The chiyuv onah works is that I don't owe you more than normal onah. And normal onah is that when I'm busy with something else, I'm not going to drop everything to be with you. So why is ... anything different? I don't think so. I am going to get any other onah, okay? You want to talk about ... I'm going to be nice on halacha, everything like that. He's not going to get any onah. He's not going to be no Shabbos, and no Yom Chol, and not anything, and not leil tevilah. No, but I... Do me a favor, you ready? I want you to start right now, right now. Since everybody's arguing with me, let's see who's right. If I'm right, if you're right, I get up, I sit over there, you sit over there. I have no problem. If I'm right, you let me go home. You'll do is, you'll look it up. Go ahead. Chayav adam... no? Look at it in the Shulchan Aruch. There's a thing that's called... you know? Exactly what I'm telling you. I keep on repeating over. He never said the patur of osek b'mitzvah patur min hamitzvah. Not what it says. It says he's patur. He's busy. He's busy. He's busy. You know patur d'mitzvah? He's patur b'davar shehu tzarich la'asot. That's what it means, mitzvah. Because you're tired in making the lawn. No one told you to make the lawn. Daniel, my lawyer, because he knows what I'm talking about. Daniel, what am I talking about? You know what I'm talking about? You like it? It's unique. It's new. It's something that nobody says, but it's true. You'll never find the word osek b'mitzvah except for this guy in...

The name over here, Kilas Yaakov, Bnei Brak, whatever his name. Who is this? That's his name, Kilas Yaakov 10? Okay, call Kilas Yaakov 10 and tell him that it doesn't say. It doesn't say. He made it up. It doesn't say. You know, it's ... and ask, maybe he sees. You see the Rashi? Oisek b'mitzvah patur min hamitzvah. It doesn't say. And you know why it doesn't say it? Because oisek b'mitzvah patur min hamitzvah means that there's two mitzvahs. There's no mitzvah if I'm busy with doing other mitzvahs. No mitzvah. I'm not mechuyav to do it. If ... mitzvah, אין פטור. Sorry, he doesn't have to do it. Dry law, but it doesn't — in reality, this won't work. So could you look at our ...? Dry law, but ... in reality, a woman is not like that. It's not a chok yavesh. Maybe it's Polish, I don't know. No, but — I asked you a question. I asked you a question. No, a woman cannot be like that. It's not a robot. No. So how come there are halachos that ... once a week? Why? Dry law, it shouldn't be like that then. I'm just saying, if you are — he brings a different thing: I'm busy now. You think — because the woman ... every night is a poel. He's a poel. Once he's a poel. But I'm saying that ... that's when he becomes ... Maybe, you know, maybe take a job that you'll be home every night. I'm not sure to do that. Not only Talmid Chacham, it's not... I'm asking you a question. Guy's in the middle of work, halacha l'maaseh, you can't find me Rabbi... if anybody talks. Guy's in the middle of work. He's middle writing a paper for his boss tomorrow, and his wife comes over to him, What are you doing? Not now, I can't. What are you doing to me? Is he mechuyiv, yes or no? That would be a different reason, because he's already... What happens if he's the boss? You should drop everything. It's not a... What if you don't have it anyway? You don't find it anywhere. It depends. האם הוא משפיע או שהוא רק...? Could you find... Give me, what do you have? Anybody. Read. So get it, just bring it, dude. I don't have it. Go, go, bring it, bring it. No, go ahead, read, read. I want you to read what it says. Yeah. Find the truth. I’m saying it very passionately. Let me wrap up. Let me wrap up what I… okay? Let me tell you what. Ready?

I asked you yesterday another question, which I think is very important. The next halacha in the Rama is that if it's past 12 hours, past 12 hours, he's allowed to leave even though he's not going to have the onaah. So I asked you a question, but you owe it to him. Imagine a guy has to pay a guy at 12 o'clock Tuesday, disappears on Monday. I'm not here. I'll leave one day early, so I'm not here. Big businessmen do that. You should know that. A good businessman does that. He never can. Oh, I'm sorry, I wasn't here. Yeah, but you owe me the money. I don't care if you weren't here, so make sure you're here, right? And you know what the answer is? I'm not mechuyiv to rearrange my whole life. You know what my chiyuv onah is? My chiyuv onah is when I'm there, I'm mechuyiv to give you onah. So within 12 hours, that's called I'm there in your onaah where I owe you, and then I can't. To not be there when the day of the onaah comes is not an issue, that's what you see clearly. I asked you a question. You owe somebody to be somewhere at a certain time. Could you imagine when they have to pay the payroll check and the person says, I'm sorry, I went away for five months. Forgive me, I wasn't here. I'm sure you're going to owe me the money, right? What are you, read, read. So find me, no, yaitzu l'derech. That's fine. I want to know, yaitzu l'derech. Yeah. There's one thing. Let's say a guy is 24 hours, seven days a week, 30 days a month. Oh, wait. If a guy is seven days a week, 24 hours... What I'm trying to get at is a pashut thing. This is what I'm trying to get at. Hayotzei l'derech. The chiyuv is—what is the chiyuv? Hayotzei l'derech chayav lifkod ishto. Either you could say chayav lifkod ishto is because of reasons shematiz. Maybe it's a very simple halacha, shematiz. Or, hayotzei l'derech, tzarich lifkod ishto—he's not going to be home, not going to be home. Therefore, you owe whatever you owe her from that time, you pay it now. You know, when a guy leaves, then it shouldn't be a chiyuv. Why not? It shouldn't be a chiyuv. It should be a person leaves. A person only... A person leaves... But inuy shehu sees the... Chayav lifkod ishto. What is that? What are you saying? No Rashi, no... He also learns other mitzvas... I say not. I think everybody... There's no Rashi. I'm sorry to tell you, there's just no Rashi. No, but that's how they learn. ... But do you tell me, you tell me where you saw oisek b'mitzvah. The Rashi says... Let me start again. Vestis is the pshat that there is a din derabbanan. What do you have? What do you have? So the Rashi sort of says the word oisek b'mitzvah. Maybe not. Maybe not. Who says? Who says it's mashma? He's mitrid b'mitzvah, so what? He's mitrid b'mitzvah. Tarud b'mitzvah. That's right. That's how I learned. He's mitrid. He's busy. It's not oisek b'mitzvah.

And the answer is, and you know what the answer is? The answer is because everything else, don't be busy with. ... But I am. I'm in the middle of job. Again, so I hold, I hold that yes, in the middle of job is right. You're not mechuyiv to stop the middle of the job. It's not about whether I'm mechuyiv or not. I'm already busy. You're interrupting me. That's right. If you're interrupting me something that I should be doing, and the word should meaning have to do, so then a kamei. What if you go out to be interrupted then? You go out now, I'm gonna have a business trip I have to go by. But that's what I'm getting at. That's exactly what I'm getting at. ... You should say to the wife, say, No, I want to be home, whatever. Another hour. Your whole point is you're busy. Everything. All you got is I'm busy. Pretty much. Okay. There's one way to learn this sugya. ... mitzvah, ... mitzvah doicheh mitzvah. It's one mitzvah. It's the mitzvah against the mitzvah. On one hand there's vestes, and on the other hand there's a mitzvah, and there's leil tefillah, and b'makom mitzvah lo gazru Rabbanan, and it's this. It's all about mitzvah, yeah? Then there's another way how to learn. The other way how to learn the sugya is not so much the mitzvah. Not that there's a mitzvah here, but— There's a chiyuv onah in certain times. The din vestus, which is not, let's say, a real shash maybe blood is going to... But it's a din. The Rabbanan gave a din vest to the seder of an isha's vest. They didn't say it b'makom that there's a chiyuv to be onah. In other words, when there's no chiyuv onah and you're going to live with her, pirush, you're going to live with her for ratzon, Chacham said don't do it b'makom vest. Yoitzei l'derech is a ta'ich, then it becomes a have to. If she stam says, I want, I have news for you, I'm going there. I'm going there. I'm going there. What happens if she says, I want, and she needs it? She needs it. She wants it. In her mental state, she needs it. Why is it not enough that she just wants? Huh? Why does she have to need it? Because she wants. No, no, maybe she's doing it, but she's in a bad matzav. Who? No, because she needs it. No, because she wants. No, because she wants. It's okay, okay. She wants. She's not going to die from it. She's not going to become a nervous breakdown. But she wants. Yes, she's a woman. Guess what? Welcome to the world. She wants. Ten minutes thinking, rabbi. What do you mean? Ten minutes? What do you mean? Why do you have to say she needs? You want the... you have to come to she needs. He's actually a pretty good kasha, but it's a pretty technical kasha, though. I mean, you patur, why? Because you're mitzri. I mean, what are you, you're so mitzri. What's, what, you need a doctor afterwards? What's mitzri? So what's—he's asking a nice ha'ara. What's the mitzri? What's the mitzri? Do you have a job to finish? No, the other way around. You want mitzri. Second shot. That what? There'll be mitzri b'tashmish; he won't go do the mitzvah. I mean, what's the... 45-minute drive. What happens if the taiches that he's tired? Let's say he's tired and he won't be able to go and do his mitzvah properly.

I'm saying, it's not the pshat you'll miss the flight. You miss the flight, it's finished. What happens if the pshat is, I can't tonight, I'm busy. I'll be busy tomorrow. Don't make me crazy tonight. I need to cough for tomorrow. What happens then? It's zicher not the svara of oisek b'mitzvah patur min hamitzvah, because it's אפשר לקיים שניהם. I hold that it makes no difference. The way I'm learning, it makes no difference. If it's going to affect your kiyum tomorrow, you're not patur. It's not patur. What do you mean you're going to go to sleep very late because of this, and immediately you're going to wake up early? You're not affecting something. Guess what? That's exactly what I was thinking about, the whole shiur, about this shaila. What happens if a guy says, you know what, it takes a whole night because whatever it is, like the seder takes a whole night, and then I miss Shacharis the next morning. Is this geder of oisek b'mitzvah patur min hamitzvah? I want to tell you, what would Hashem be happy, that you have your shalom bayis or you'd be praying like you usually do in the morning? I don't know. It's not... it's halacha. This is halacha. And besides, what if he's living with your woman? Halacha l'maaseh, he'll be patur the bi'ah and he won't do the mitzvah. Good luck. You won't have a wife. Very afterwards. Big thing. Never mind. What's that? A guy has to be with his wife. What are you talking? You're גרילע over here by little monkey over here. Let me tell you what I want. Listen what I want. Tell me, if he's going l'dvar mitzvah, makes a difference deraisa, derabbanan? I never saw him make chiluk. See, that's the question. Why don't you ask that? Oisek b'mitzvah patur min hamitzvah, deraisa, derabbanan. What is the proof? Doesn't prove what I said. Doesn't prove it's true, because you can't be matir. Anything which is not a dvar reshus is dvar mitzvah. Maybe everything which is not a dvar reshus becomes a dvar mitzvah. Exactly the opposite. I know I should be—sorry. Now you scared me. Now you scared. Now I'm scared. Sorry, it's different than shevet halevi. I want to know what's wrong, different than shevet halevi. I don't have to do with my wife. Maybe. Who told you? Who told you? I don't know. It's a good question. And the same shaila would be: is there a halacha of being matir prishah סמוך לווסת because of this yoiser l'derech? I don't know. It's a good shaila. I hold maybe yes, unless it's done b'kvius. Unless it's done b'kvius, then it's— Maybe. Let me ask you another question. What about if he will be? He what? We're always worried that she. What about him? I'll ask you a better question. You see, the truth is I really should be asking these questions because you're probably not ready in your mind to understand that I deal with this all day. I deal with this junk all day, mamash all day long, with these type of shailas. I hear a lot more than I'd like to. Baruch Hashem, it goes in one ear and comes out the other, and I make believe I never heard. But what happens if a person feels that the aveirah issur, it's not going to be matir? This is the best. What happened? Anytime? The problem is his wife wasn't here for a few days. Now she comes back, okay, so now the shaila is the best. He won't do what he has to do. Could we be matir pirsum? Maybe, yeah. What does that be say? D'Oraisa? I don't know. Not big enough to say, but big enough to give you the shiur and tell you these are big shailas. Let me tell you what I really did. What I really did was I started opening you up into this. There's a lot here. There's a lot. The hagdaros of this are so much that it's unbelievable. I do know that they discussed—there's a Magen Avraham, a very famous Magen Avraham. You hear my shaila? You hear my shaila? You never thought about this shaila? You never thought about this shaila? Should we matir the pirsum ...? Huh? Rebbe, this is issur d'Oraisa, d'Rabbanan? You find who says...

Shema tizneh, maybe she'll be mezaneh. So there's no marriage. What kind of marriage? If he goes away for two days, you're not חייב to go away Yud-Beis mil. You go away Yud-Beis mil, right? And in this Yud-Beis, what is it? Take one day, what is it, one day Yud-Beis mil. One mil is eighteen minutes. One mil is eighteen minutes, so Yud-Beis mil is eighteen times twelve. That's all it is. Did you see the Pischei Teshuva? Siman שקאסה, דשיעור הדרך, נראה שהוא שנים עשר מיל. How much is twelve mil? Two hours. So if he travels away two hours, I want to know, halachah l'maaseh, if a guy travels for two hours... He goes back on that, no? The famous Rambam that said that you're not supposed to... that you shouldn't be... your wife... So what's a derech? So what is the klal the person... how far? So what is the derech? The Pischei... says, לא יבא ולא... או ביאס הדרך, קשה לה. How long is that derech? Yud-Beis mil. Not going on how long he's gone. But that's on the first day. Oh, vadai, a goyish maaseh, it's not goyish. Right. For that, that way, that way. Okay, so what is the shiur? How much? Missing one oinah. So we're ... missing one oinah. You're missing one time, that's it. That's ... I don't know what's going on. And what about if? Is it only her? It's only him too. Okay. The kitzur, these are all she'eilos, she'eilos, an eyehole, like I told you, that there's one way to learn this sugya: mitzvah against mitzvah. One mitzvah, this mitzvah, that mitzvah, the ... or this ... what's called normal chiyuv, and the chachamim weren't matkia the normal chiyuv because of prishas ... The normal chiyuvei are not ... the normal issues, chachamim weren't gozer against because, for example, if her leil tevilah is week after month after month, so be it. So be it. Chacham didn't say prishas ... vest. Prishas ... vest is at the end of the month, vest has to come, there's דין of prishas ... vest. But not if it breaks into ... The normal pidah of a husband and wife. That's the way I learned the sugya. Okay? He's not happy. There's so much human factor. Unbelievable. There's so much human factor.