Hilchos Shabbos: Melting Snow and Ice—Molid, Nolad, and Sechitas Peiros

Transcript

Sustaineded is from Shamshank. Maybe you can give me the Shamshank. Shamshank he needs. The book's in there. Okay. So, Shin chaf, we did all about peiros. So peiros goes all the way till, to ches. It goes all the way to ches. We did, we did. We touched on every... Now, hasoichet dag, okay, so it's also food. Then it comes hasheleg. We'll do the sugya of sheleg. And of course, we begin with sheleg and we'll end with ice cubes, the big sugya of ice cubes. This is right here. So, hasheleg v'habarad ein meraskin osam. Sheleg, we all know, snow, and barad is hail. So, ein meraskin. Meraskin is to crush. Where does this come from? Peh, it's a Gemara, Shabbos nun aleph, braisa. Okay, look at Beragoyla, it's a braisa. So what is meraskin? D'hainu l'shabran, it's to crush it, l'chatichos dakos k'dei sheyizuvu meimav, in order that the water should flow from it. Aval nosnin hu l'soch kosel, yayin o mayim, but technically you're allowed to take an ice cube and put it into water or yayin, v'hu nimoch me'eilav v'eino choshesh. You don't have to worry about it. Now it's interesting, the lashon v'eino choshesh, I guess it means v'eino choshesh for the problem, even though l'choira it is technically whatever the problem of sheleg and barad is, you still have it here, but you don't have to worry about the problem. That's the lashon of v'eino choshesh. We'll see, we'll see. First, Rabosai, first let's read. I'm just reading. You'll soon see that every word, be'ezras Hashem yisbarach, we're going to work on every word, every syllable even. And I'm going to show you, I spoke this over with many, many. I spoke with Rav Shteinberg once about this years and years ago. I had many kashas on these Mishnah Beruros, mamash stirahdik in Mishnah Beruros, and we're going to show them to you. And then, of course, the nafka mina would be the halacha l'maaseh of the ice cube. Now, so again, sheleg is snow, barad is hail, meraskin means to crush. It's a braisa in Shabbos nun aleph. D'hainu, the Mechaber explains what it means, l'shabram, l'chatichos dakos kedei sheyizuvu meimav. But, noisno l'toch kos shel yayin o mayim v'hu nimuch me'eilav, v'eino choishesh. See, he wants to say eino choishesh means even mid'rabbanan, ken? Or v'eino choishesh might mean that even though it has the problem, don't worry about the problem. Whatever it is in the beginning is that it could be an issue, don't worry about that issue. All right? There's two ways how to read this Mechaber. V'chein im hanichan b'chamah k'neged hamedurah, if you put it next to a fire or in the sun, that it becomes by itself melted, v'nifsheru, and it becomes by itself, mutarim, then it's mutar. So here he doesn't say v'eino choishesh, he just says mutarim, that it's mutar. Okay? Now, we're going to discuss why it's used the lashon of mutarim in here, choishesh, we'll get to that later. But let's give a good important hakdamah, and then the Mishnah Beruros read well. The hakdamah is that there's three shitos in the Rishonim. What's the problem in the sugya? What's wrong with being merasek sheleg and barad? The poskim use it as a lashon for itself, issur risuk, that's how they call it, the issur of risuk. What is the problem? So Rashi in Aleph of Beis says that it's mishum moled. Moled is that you created a new entity, and that is that you made from ice, snow, water. So that new entity is a sheilah of moled. Now what does moled mean? You actually created? If you actually create something on Shabbos, I could hear, maybe it's like a real, real melacha. It's dummy. It's dummy l'melacha. That's the lashon of Rashi, and we'll soon see the Mishnah Berurah quotes that Rashi as the first reason for this halacha. Moled. So remember two nekudos in this Rashi. One is that it's moled, and don't confuse it with nolad. Moled is not nolad. For example, if someone says the moled of the levana, and if he says the word the nolad of the levana, you know that he's a real am ha'aretz, because moled is not nolad and nolad is not moled. Moled is dummy l'melacha and nolad is muktzah. Okay? It's two different sugyas, two different inyanim. One has nothing to do with the other. So remember, gabai should not say the nolad of this week, of this one, huh? Let's wait. Let's first get all the ta'amim. Then we'll see why one doesn't hold of the other ta'am.

Mishum moylid, and the reason is it's dami l'melachah. You look at the Mishnah Berurah, he brings that as the first reason. Look at the Mishnah Berurah, seif katan lamed gimmel. Hashel v'habor merask boisem, d'hainu l'shaber l'chatichos k'dei sheyizovu meimav, d'dami l'melachah. D'dami l'melachah, sheboirei hamayim halalu, that he's creating this water. Okay? Lashon dami. Sha'ar HaTziyun, Rashi, lamed daled. You see he's quoting Rashi. Now I want to make an interesting diyuk: k'dei sheyizovu meimav. What happens if that's not my intent? Who said maybe by the sheleg v'borer ein meraskin oisam, and if my intent is not k'dei sheyizovu meimav, there's no sugya בכלל. Now according to Rashi, that Rashi says the reason is that I'm creating water, so then maybe the intent of the water is important here. The k'dei sheyizovu meimav might be essential, right? If it's about the meimav, so then the water, it has to be that k'dei. The point is k'dei sheyizovu meimav. Otherwise, it's an eino mechaven. We're still going to learn about all this, but let's first get the Rashi, and that is the first reason, the dami l'melachah, and it's only dami, so it can't be, of course, not a de'oraisa for sure not, but it's a derabbanan. What type of derabbanan? It's mashma it's like a gezeirah derabbanan. Okay, so keep in mind, it's not only a de'oraisa, because like I said, when you get the sugya clear, you're going to see big chidushim, big chidushim. And the reason why we'll have the right to say those big chidushim is because we know the sugya. And those that are going to yell and scream, I don't know if they learned the whole sugya word by word, inch by inch, letter by letter. So again, it's dami l'melacha. It doesn't say it's a de'oraisa, nor does it say that it's a regular derabbanan, but rather what does it say? It says dami, that it's domeh l'melacha. Okay. Okay, it's domeh l'melacha. ... It's the first good thing that happened to me all day, I was saying this ... Okay, now. So it's dami l'melacha. Rashi, that's Rashi's shita. So we're talking about melting ice, melting snow. Shulchan Aruch aser. Reason: Mishnah Berurah, first one, sheborei hamayim, and it's dami l'melacha. Rashi shita, Mishnah Berurah cites that, siman קנח. What's the issur? The issur is that's molid. You're making, you're creating. You're creating water from ice to water, and it's dami. And molid is which melacha? Dami, dami l'melacha. It looks like you're doing something, you're creating something. Chazal said you're not allowed to make something new because it's a yitzur, it's a creation on Shabbos. Good. The Rambam, perek chaf aleph, halacha yud gimmel, brings it in the shvusim of shechitah, and thus the Rishonim and the Acharonim learn in the Rambam that it has to do with shechitah. The Mishnah Berurah brings this taam also. That's the inami. Inami, you see inami? Gezeirah shema yischot peiros ha'omedim l'mashkin. So you see that it's a gezeirah shema. Sha'ar HaTziyun, Rambam, seif katan lamed hei, quotes the Rambam. It's chaf aleph, perek chaf aleph, halacha yud-gimmel. Halacha yud-gimmel. So it's a derabbanan. Oh, now let's just chisel away, and even in the derabbanan, it's not a real derabbanan, derabbanan, but it's gezeirah shema. Gezeirah shema yischot, peiros ha'omedim l'mashkeh. Why am I stressing this? Because it might be nafka mina where it's not going to come to the gezeirah for one reason or another, that it's not mamash doimeh. There's a reason to say that you won't make the mistake. Maybe it could be mutar. But it's a magid mishneh. This point of that it's gezeirah shema, that's a magid mishneh in the Rambam, and you see that the Heilige Mishnah Berurah, in his leshonei hazahav, quotes it, k'lachar yad, k'ilu that's the taam. Hinami, gezeirah shema yischot, peiros ha'omedim l'mashkeh. So we have over here Rashi, and we have over here the Rambam. Sefer haTerumos is the third reason, se'if siman reish lamed daled, not because of moled, not because of sechitah like...

The Rambam, but because of nolad. Nolad is muktzah. You look at the Mishnah Berurah in Shaar HaTziyun, and he says that Ibidavka didn't bring this reason. V'shamati taam d'nolad, d'mechaber leisfir lei, midehiter neged hachamah. Now what does he mean? He means as follows. If you look further on in the Mechaber, it says, You can't make muktzah, or once it's muktzah you can't use it. We'll discuss. That's what we're talking about, whether you're allowed to melt ice. So that's what we're going to discuss. V'chein im hinicham b'chamah, oi keneged hamedurah, v'nifsheru, mutarim. So here he doesn't say about the issur of the ma'aseh, but rather the cheftz is mutar or not. So if the cheftz is mutar, obviously it's not muktzah. And so you see, hishmatti, I left out the taam of nolad because you see that he's matir it neged hachamah. And if the reason is, like the Sefer Trumas, that it's a problem of muktzah, you got muktzah here, and that's the chiluk, the v'eino choshesh. That's why I said, if you look carefully, there's a reason why the Mechaber uses the lashon eino choshesh, because there's eino choshesh on the ma'aseh, and here it's the mutarim, the issue is more what? The result. It becomes mutar and there's no problem of muktzah. So in this Mechaber, you see clearly that he doesn't pasken like the Sefer Trumas. Shaar HaTziyun, se'if katan lamed-hei, hishmati taam d'nolad. Okay. Now, comes out a big yesod, that there's a very big nafka mina between the taamim of the Rishonim, if what's the problem of shelo giborod. If the taam of shelo giborod is nolad... So then it's in the ma'aseh. If the taam is gezeirah shema yischait, l'choirah it's in the ma'aseh. More in the ma'aseh, I could... If you create something, shema yischait, no? If we're going to say that you're allowed to use stuff that you were soichet like this, maybe you'll be shema yischait. I could hear you. That's if you let you use what it is, or it's that you can't melt it because... I don't know. That's what I'm trying to tell you. It's not muchach, l'choirah. I could hear it more in the ma'aseh, but... If I let you use this type of thing, maybe someone will come to be soich. Yesh layin. But one thing for sure, in the sefer HaTrumos is klar that it's in the toitzah, all right? So it's a very big nafka mina in the Rishonim's taamim if molid—I'm sorry, if risuk, is a risuk is ma'aseh or a toitzah. Ah, you'll say it's yeshivah sheteirah, chas v'shalom. Not that it's anything wrong with yeshivah sheteirah. One second, that didn't come out right. I spent my life learning yeshivah sheteirah. I don't mean it that way. What I meant to say was, it doesn't have to even go there. It's not a lomdish svara. It's the Mishnah Berurah, Sha'ar HaTziyun, halachicdik. Because since it's in toitzah, that's the mutarim. So you see that according to the sefer HaTrumos, it's toitzah, and still it's mutar. So you see that we don't pasken like sefer HaTrumos. It's not a lomdish, like a chakirah, is it the ma'aseh or toitzah. It's like, yeah, l'maaseh, l'maaseh, regular according to sefer HaTrumos, only the toitzah is asur. Masheikh, according to the other—it's mutar to do it, just the question of is it muktzah afterwards. That would be l'choirah my shaylah. I don't know. We're talking apples and oranges. Correct. There's a question of is it muktzah. There's a question, is it mutar to do. Correct, and that's what I'm getting at. This is what I'm getting at. I'm not sure when in the sefer hatrumis, is it only terumah, or maybe it's ma'aser also? Are you allowed to make muktzah on Shabbos? No. Davar mechanah, right? You're not allowed to. But that could be when you're making the muktzah from the old, meaning you're taking something which was mukhan and you're making it not mukhan. But here, creating a new entity, it's by molid. Not the same story. To mevatel keli meichanoi means something that's here that was mutar, and now you're making it muktzah. But something which is disappearing as becoming something new nolad, I don't know. Is there an issur to make a nolad on Shabbos? It's a nice ha'arah. But that's one of the she'eilos I have. Okay? So remember, write this down, because this is good. This is good, the she'eilos. It's good, the she'eilos. You hear? If you look, you like it. You're not masking. Why'd you mask? No. If you knew how hard I'm working now to concentrate, my head is spinning like a—like, you know what a globe is? I would say I'm going quicker than the globe.

It's spinning. I'm working. I'm working hard. That's the way I work. I work hard. That's the way it is, okay? L'choira, if you hold it's ma'aseh, right? So then it's ma'aseh. If you hold it's toitzah, what would happen? What would happen in toitzah? Maybe it's only toitzah, not ma'aseh. Maybe it's mutar to do. I'm saying, you see that you're allowed to do it, and it's not muktzah. So it says you're allowed to do it. You're allowed to put it there, right? But if you held that it was asur in a case where it was taka muktzah, so what according to the Sefer Trumos is the halacha? That you're allowed to do it, but just not use it, or you're not allowed to do it either? I don't know. It's a good ha'ara. And ha'ara number two I really want to make is, according to the other shitos, that you're not allowed to do it, what happens if you did it? Are you allowed to use it? Maybe al tzaltzis d'rabbanan, you did something wrong, chayav niskar. But that's probably the issur also, ma'aseh and the toitzah. ... that's not right, because that's not really doing it. No, ... Because it's Hashem doing it, it's the sun. The sun by itself. But you purposely put it there to happen, that's called by itself. That's called by itself. That's no right. That's mutar in general, right? That's what the Mishnah Berurah is saying. Mishnah Berurah is saying, but al toitzah it would still remain asur. According to the other shitos, in most you're over d'rabbanan, so ma'aseh Shabbos ... maybe it's mutar. We talked about that. Wasn't there a goyen or something? You can't concentrate that much on the goyen, so let's go weiter. Tomorrow we'll be able to concentrate. The goyen is what? Toitzah ma'aseh. By ... that first goyen in the Biur Halacha. Yeah, I know that, but that's what it was. That's how we learned it. I can't concentrate. Okay. The Kitzur HaBoisai, this is the shaylah, yeah? The shaylah is, is the pshat toitzaah or ma'aseh, and it's not stam a sheinah shetikal teirah. You see, the Mishnah Berurah makes it mamish pshat in the mechaber in halacha l'maaseh, because according to the sefer Trumas, it's muktzah, so it's in toitzaah. According to the Sheleg, if you make sheleg and you merasek it, according to the sefer Trumas, the problem is muktzah. And the Shaar HaTziyun says we obviously don't pasken that way, because you see that you're allowed to put it in the sun. So you see that the toitzaah is mutar. So my shaylah is, if you hold takkeh that it's muktzah according to the sefer Trumas, are you allowed to do it? Maybe it's because the sheleg is the muktzah, if the nolad, when it turns, becomes a sheleg, that's what it means? No. What it means is that it becomes water. From sheleg you make water, and that's nolad. It's a different shaylah; that we're going to learn later. The meantime is the problem is you took sheleg from before Shabbos, all right? You took sheleg—it's a different sugya. If you took sheleg from before Shabbos and you put it in the sun, an ice cube that you made before Shabbos, you put it in the sun. According to Rashi, it's the issur of molid. According to the Rambam, it's the issur of sechitah. According to sefer Trumas, it's the issur of nolad, muktzah. Says the Shaar HaTziyun, altz nolad, so if you did it, it would still be asur. Meaning, even though you have the heter of al tmei'eilah, but it's still nolad, still muktzah. Masha'en kein, according to the other shitos, since it's only in the ma'aseh, right, and there is no ma'aseh, so then it's mutar. So I'm clarifying, in the sefer Trumas, that the problem is it became—so is the issur also to do it? Would the issur be to do it? Maybe it's no issur, just yenahalah to use it. That's all it is. To what? To make a noyled. Is there a problem to make a noyled? In the same... this would be a problem. Second shailah is, in the tzad of molid—okay, come, let's go back—in the tzad of molid, and in the tzad of the Rambam that it's shechitah, so what's the toitzah? Maybe the toitzah is mutar. I don't know. It's a nice sevara; we'll get to it later, okay? I'm just learning with you in the meantime, okay? But before we go weiter, I have to tell you that I have big, big problems with all these halachos, and I'll explain to you why. The Mishnah Berurah says clearly, right, that we pasken— And the son, he says it's mutar, and you said because it's me'eileh. Isn't that mashma that if it would be a case where it wasn't me'eileh, it would be asur? Look, chumra. But I'm saying is, but then maybe all he means, you wouldn't be allowed to do it. To say mutar is not dafka. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. That's why I was clear. He does pick that case. Right, but I spoke about this. Is the choshesh the ma'aseh and the mutar is the toitzah? But maybe mutar just means that it's mutarim. The thing is mutar. Mutar to do it. No, mutarim is not to do it. Mutarim is that it is.

Right, so what does he say? Because it's a case of me'eilah, therefore the thing is mutar. Mashma that if you didn't do a me'eilah, then even the thing would be asur. But I don't know if the ma'aseh is asur. That's the shaylah. I don't know if for trumas, and the other shittah you are clarifying whether the chefetz is asur. Right. So I'm being medayek that he says that it's mutar since it was a case of me'eilah. Mashma if it's not a case of me'eilah, then the chefetz is asur. Right. L'choira, the din of the mutarim would work that way. Not that the ma'aseh, but even the totza'ah would be that it's now asur. Okay. Now, the Mishnah Berurah seems to say, you hear, that we take two out of the three shitos l'halachah, but the third shittah is bichlal not l'halachah, which means the sefer Trumas is bichlal not l'halachah. The Mishnah Berurah himself, I'm going to show you, says clearly that according to Rama, we pasken like Rashi's shittah and not the Rama. It's a mefurash in Mishnah Berurah. I'm going to show you mefurash, mefurash in Mishnah Berurah. You look at the Rama in Shin Chav Vav, sif yud. Are you allowed to use soap, liquid, on Shabbos? Soap, hard, on Shabbos is memachek. Soap which is liquid, are you allowed to use it on Shabbos? Okay. So Shin Chav Vav, sif yud, okay. Mutar lirchotz yadav b'mursen, hagah, d'gibul k'lachar yad. Okay. Then he brings the case of zeif. B'boiris shekorin zeif. So he brings from the Binyamin Zev siman reish ayin ches, d'halachah is noylad. It's asur altz noylad, right? Says the Mishnah Berurah... V'dami l'reisuch shelek u'barot, shenisba'elu b'simen shin chaf, she'asar, gam kein mitam zeh. So according to the taam of noylad, yeah, then it's aser. V'dami, v'havi noylad, and it's aser. Says the Magan Avraham that according to the second shita that's mutar, why is it mutar? D'sfira lei d'mash asru Chazal l'rasik sheleg brov משום גזירת סחיטת פירות, the Rambam, okay? שאף השלג והברד מימיהם הם עומדים. ואם כן, בורית ושאר חלב שאינם עומדים למשקין, since it's not עומד למשקין, then it becomes mutar lechatchila to do it. So the Rama obviously is paskening noylad. So how could the Mishnah Berurah say, I'm not gores the taam of noylad? Because—maybe I missed something. The Rama says clearly that it's al taam of noylad. The Rama himself holds it's noylad. I'm asking you a kasha, so what does he mean by this? No. I understand that. The Rama says, but what's his cheshbon? His cheshbon is, I'm only bringing the two ta'amim because of—he's explaining the Mechaber, right? But according to the Rama, which he says later, and which Rama does he bring? Shin yud ches. Wait, give me a minute, I'm going to show you what I mean. Rashi is not noylad. Rashi is not noylad. Noylad is muktzah. Noylad is a—looks like you created something. Shabbur, look at the Mishnah Berurah, he brings two ta'amim. There's noylad and there's noylad. Okay. Rashi doesn't hold of noylad. Rashi holds of noylad. So according to the Rama, the taam is noylad. According to the Mechaber— Why is it mutar? So the Mishnah Berurah explains because of shechitas peiros. According to the taam of moylid, what's the halacha? By the story of the soap. So what's the pshat in this Mishnah Berurah? How could the Mishnah Berurah come and tell me in the Mechaber that the taam is the Rambam, and the taam is Rashi, moylid? Later on you told me that there's the taam hamatirim, which is not the Rama, which is the first shita that's mutar, is because of the Rambam. Yeah, but what happened to the taam of moylid? So that's what you say, but the Mishnah Berurah says not like you. In Rashi, Mishnah Berurah says not like—exactly. The first Mishnah Berurah says clearly that in the Mechaber we're saying two taamim. I stumped everybody. Why is there moylid over here? Same thing, you created something new. You created water. Whatever you created. I want to know what the Mesilas says. What are you creating? Can I ask you a question? If it's noylad— What's a noylad? Noylad and moylid is the same thing. What are you talking about? Noylad was existing already; it just came. Noylad means you made something brand new. The egg came out of the chicken. That's something else. That's because—l'aferes, it's not noylad maybe, but noylad means—

Maylid is something that's created brand new. That's called noylad. How could something be not? Factually, it's the same. The shaylah is, what's the issur? Is it noylad muktsa, or is it moylad of tzanaia na'aseh, called moylad? But once it's new, it's new. It's the same shaylah, Mr. Bruer. Why do you pick a noylad over moylad? Moylad over noylad. Same thing. It's not the same thing. One is muktsa and asur b'diavad, and one is an issur de'oraisa, and that's all. That's exactly what I tried to tell you. We begin with it. One is moylad and one is noylad. We're looking at seif katan shin chavav, seif katan lamed. Correct. I'm not moving. You know, let me tell you something. I didn't come here after a whole day of yesurim to—now you guys don't understand what I'm talking about. I refuse. I want the oilam to sit here and jump at the diyuk. It's a me'iridike diyuk. It's a pele, a mamash davar shel pele. I'm not going to move until the oilam says, Yes, this is gevaldik. The Mishnah Berurah—there's a heilige Mishnah Berurah. The Chofetz Chaim sat there and decided that in the mechaber we can learn two shitos. We can learn that it's moylad, and we can learn that it's chitas peiros. Something's wrong, because later on he says not like that. The Rama that asers the soap, he says— All the Mishnah Berurah says, according to the shitos that the issur is outshema yischait, so then you won't have that problem over here. So, but I don't see, but what do you do with moylad? It always goes together. If it's—those shitos, you're going to hold that it's asur. So let me speak it out. Let me— I mean, what is the mechaber? What does it mean? He's obviously explaining the two shitos, no, according to Ramah and according to the other shita. It's kashe on the Shachinu over here by us. How can he say, l'Ramah? He said, the mechaber, okay, the mechaber is good, not גרע. So the truth, he is גרע for Rama. A little bit later, in the next seif katan, he brings the Ramah here. In lamed hei he brings the Ramah. ולדעת רמא בסימן שיח, סעיף טז בהגה, גם הכא יש להחמיר, דאף דנימוח מאליו, אסור משום נולד. So he brings the nolad. Now let me ask you a question. According to the mechaber, is there a problem of zeh? So Mishnah Berurah is explaining that it's only according to the nolad. What about according to the taam of molid? It's just do it, but it's by itself. Happens by itself, no? By itself? The story of using soap, you make liquid soap. Is there a problem? And the answer is, it's nolad. So if it's nolad, then it's also molid. I'm sorry, it's the same story. Shalom, what the issur is. So what does he go and he says that according to the shitos that learn that it's not nolad, which is l'choira he means the mechaber, that we don't pasken nolad. But I thought you said that the two always go together, that molid and sechitas peiros are one shita of the mechaber. It's not a problem. According to the mechaber, the implication is that according to Ramah that it's nolad, it's a problem, and according to everything else it's not a problem. You want to know what this Mishnah Berurah should have wrote? That everybody holds it's asur. You know why? Because either it's nolad or molid. Have a nice day. That's the end of the story. Is there a broad shita of the mechaber that he holds of both molid and ...? Yeah, the Mishnah Berurah says it. He says he holds of both. He says it could be one of these two taamim. If the taam of the mechaber is ... I'm stealing my shi... Nobody's that sure. Not sure. Now you're stealing my shi... Pashut. What's the nafkamina? Because there's nafkaminas in the time of the Rambam and the Mechaber. Does the Mishnah Berurah hold we hold both? In the Mechaber, we don't hold both. That's the shaylah. That's going to be tonight's shiur, which obviously we're going to have to finish tomorrow. I'm going to say big chiddushim, big chiddushim here to say. What? I don't know. Just don't jump so fast with this Ramah. Okay, now, so are you maskim to me that for some reason there's no noylad here? Now, why does the Ramah over here not be magia? That's also a good question. I don't understand. Why does the Ramah listen to the Mechaber say kefirah? V'chein haminhag b'chamah... See, I know I get... I just did it for theatrical reasons. Did you hear what I want? V'chein haminhag b'chamah k'neged hamedurin shemutarim, the Ramah says chayav v'kayam. What are you talking about? It's first. That's right here. Not... We already said it. Sheini ches. ... Sheini ches, we're going to learn the Ramah later. Abaye, pay attention. It's a work of art. Today's shiur is a work of art, but you have to just listen to the pieces. And that's what the...

The Mishnah Berurah means, ... according to the Ramo from before, there's no reason to say it over here. Shvach. Shvach. Are you maskim to the ...? Okay. But that's what the Mishnah Berurah means, right? The Mishnah Berurah means that according to ... ches. Okay. Now, okay. I'm going to show you, okay, that the Ramo holds l'taam of noylad. Wait, the Ramo here says, ... דלא דמי לבורר ... דלא דמי? Oh, wait. Oh, wait, by borer, I feel there's some difference. It's a ... Why the Mishnah Berurah not say it? That's what he says. Is that what he says? You maskim, that's what he says? I don't see it's different. What? What? Yes, so what he means to ask this kasha. Which part of the kasha? They're saying it's not a kasha. So what? I think he's just saying ... Huh? Who's the ...? What's the two ta'amim? Yes. Why would the Mishnah Berurah be not gores that chelek of molid? I ... the hold, I ... the hold, and again, you know what it is? Give me time to prove myself, meaning by tomorrow, the end of the shiur, you'll see I'm 100% right with what I'm saying, that the Mishnah Berurah really held that the real reason is chitas peiros. That's the real reason. The real reason of shechitas peiros. The real reason of shechitas peiros. He did put in Shin Ches, in Shin Chaf. Now let me show you what I want. Let me show what I want. We're in the siman about shechitah. Take a look at Shin Yud Ches, okay, se'if tes-zayin, which is where he gets this Rama from. The story over there is, ifandri, ifandri is a kugel, okay? It's a kugel that can melt, that has fat in it and it melts. So what's the halacha? You're allowed to put the ifanda כנגד האש, right? That's the shita of the Mechaber. What's the shita of the Rama? That you're not allowed to do it. What's the reason you're not allowed to do it? And the answer is because— No, he says, משום נולד. Wait, but it's Shin Yud Ches. Yeah, it's the seif of trumos of nolad. It does say. You have to look. It's true, not the Rama. I'm saying, it's nolad. Okay, so it's nolad. And that's this Mishnah Berurah, right? Okay. What does the Mishnah Berurah's ta'ina why the Mechaber holds it's mutar? What is what? No. What's what? What does the Mishnah Berurah say why the Mechaber holds it's mutar? Yeah, yeah. It's mimeila. What happened to shechitas peiros? Make up your mind. Is the issue shechitas peiros, or is the issue nolad Rashi? What? You have no idea how— I'll never forget Rav Scheinberg with his... He starts. He looks excited. It's a peltige thing. On one hand, the Mishnah Berurah is busy with... You never saw him get excited. You never saw. He gets... he has a very good kasha. It's all excited. Why are you making a kasha? You don't understand. On one hand, the Mishnah Berurah... but you don't have beautiful kashas. On one hand, the Mishnah Berurah talks to mechaber, shechitas peiros, and he favores shechitas peiros. And over there he favores what? Do maaseh. Even do maaseh. I can't learn like this. I have to first—you first got to hear what I'm saying. I heard. No, you didn't hear. On one Mishnah Berurah... I'm very tired. One Mishnah Berurah is what? No. Shechitas peiros. Shechitas peiros he favors. Very good, but even... And over there in siman ches he favors ma'ilit. Even... He said it was m'meila. That's what. Even Rashi is modeh it's mutar. Yeah, I'm smashing the ice cubes. That's why it's aser. I'm doing a maaseh. I'm not doing maaseh. It's putting next to the heat. I'm doing maaseh. That's why it's mutar. Did you just tell me that the same Magen Avraham over there is... Didn't you just tell me that he favors ma'ilit? Magen Avraham... in... Am I not asking meiredik? Why does the Mishnah Berurah choose in the mechaber to favor over there shechitas peiros, and over here he chooses to favor...

Over there, he ... what nachamali, ... peiris, and then in ... What's the difference? What's the difference? I'll answer with the difference. You're taking something and you're melting it. What's the difference? ... What's the difference? ... Rabbi Eli, hire you to be my lawyer against all these gangsters who are ganging up against me. I say it's a davar pashut, davar pashut. Why did ... mention this thing? That's a kasha. Take it away. Take it up. Come on, take up the fight. Let's go. Why ask him? Why ask him? He says, on this thing, he says ... That's how he asks his questions. He doesn't speak English. What does the ... have to do with this? That's the ... that says that the mechaber doesn't go with ... So why is he asking from ... over here? He asks it different words, but it's the same question. That was that ... that says that the mechaber doesn't go with ... I'm not even asking from ... I'm asking over there he ... and over here he ... Right, so it's really the same kasha, right? Okay, it's the same question. So why is ... over here? That's what he means. Of course. Why is ... over here? I over there. But I don't care, so someone else asks. That's a good question, too. I asked him before they came out with these fancy ... Why? I just thought it would be ... more. You said to fight the fight for you. So if he sees on the bottom, leave him ... I mean, if the guy on the bottom says it, then he'll be happy. I say that. No, that's a good kasha. Now it's a good kasha. That's a good question. It's on the whole meilah. It's the same question, different words. Different words, same kasha. That's the kasha. This question is over there, he's dealing with not al tnai, and here he's dealing with al tnai. Okay, but it's both reasons. No, but the meilah—okay, let's go back. L'choira, here it should be asur al tnai. L'choira, not. It's not al tnai. It doesn't have to do with how it happened. That was the whole ... that even if it happened b'meizid, ... asur al tnai. Right? What is he answering? What is he answering? So what's the teretz then? Obviously he's not asking al tnai. He says noila. He says the word noila. He's not asking al muksa. He's asking ... There's nothing—you can't get around muksa. There's no way to get around. Okay, so listen to me carefully. You can fight with me all you want. I'm saying a very pashut zach. Here he talks noiled, here he talks shechitas peres. Which one is it? Make up your mind. Shatn the mechaber. We'll get back to it tomorrow, okay? Let's just get the information out, all right? According to this, yeah, lefi cheshbon zeh yeitze, that according to the Mishnah Berurah's shitas haMechaber is Rashi and not the Rambam, right? Because he talks about moled, noiled, or whatever, and not shechitas peres. And in siman yud-ches, it's the other way around, okay? Unless you say a chiddush. Unless you say a gevaldige chiddush. According to the Rambam, shechitah—what happens by nasa me'eilav? That's my shaylah. Is nasa me'eilav a sevara? If nasa me'eilav is a sevara, by noiled... And ma'ilit, so if it's na'aseh me'eilav, it's mutar. Whereas na'aseh me'eilav, a true svara, even by shechitas peiros, you say no. You don't like it. You don't care what—if it's na'aseh me'eilav. Shechitas peiros is also a gezeirah anyway. Let you use it, and you'll come to. Who said it? Remember I started the shiur with this. Remember this? Remember this? You remember? And I was trying to get to a point. Is shechitas peiros in the lemaaseh, is it in the toitzah or is it in the maaseh? Or both. And na'aseh me'eilav. Rabosai, you have no idea how beautiful today's shiur is. And I know it's hard because it's quick and it's the sugya you just came in. We'll chew it over; we'll do it again tomorrow. Rabosai, ich zog dir emes la'amito. I'm saying an emesdik vort, emes la'amito, emes pashut pshat, glatt, brisk. If you hold that the problem is the maaseh, or if you hold the problem is the toitzah, there's a very big nafka mina na'aseh me'eilav. Maybe the heter of na'aseh me'eilav takes care of both already also. Why? Because what's the difference? If it's na'aseh me'eilav, there's no problem. Shechitas peiros is na'aseh me'eilav. It's me'eileha, me'apeiros. No, but not in this case of borer and shelech. That's what I'm trying to tell you. It's only a gezeirah atu.

When it's a zero, too, maybe naaseh meileh is good. Wait, now I'll explain to you what I want, okay? Now, so when the Mishnah Berurah over there, when the Mishnah Berurah over there—what? He's nervous tonight, so tell him to calm down. He's not nervous. He's with me. He's with me. He's on board. No, actually, understand. They're actually half a sefer. When something's being done b'yadayim. What? What? The Mechaber is maskim that there's a problem of nolad when you're doing it b'yadayim, when you're doing the maaseh. But if it's just me'eileh, where it's just the toltzah, like he's talking about in Shin Chaf— In meileh or nolad? Nolad. Even in nolad. That's true. That's true. Shartzin say not like that. The Chazon Ish says not like that. The Chazon Ish is asur. Shartzin says mutar by— That's his shartzin's raya. Okay. Look at Lamed Hey. By Chazon— b'yadayim? No, it's me'eileh. It's asur. Now, rabosai, don't pay attention to that. Listen to me. I'm with them. Yitzi, Yitzi, come on. I need help here tonight. They're killing me here. The Rashi and the Rambam. Yeah. Rashi and Rambam. It's here. It's in se'if katan lamed gimmel, right? What about in se'if katan lamed daled? He brings the sevara of me'eileh, right? How does he bring it? Nu, go ahead. Read, read, read. Lamed daled: ve'eino choshesh, ki'ilu lo avid ma'aseh b'yadayim, lo gazru bei. Is he going according to both ta'amim? Chayra. So yutzmuchach that even in the sevara of the Rambam... Yeah, the special sevara of me'eilav. That's what he just said. That's the Mishnah Berurah before. I'm telling you emes lamito. Now I'm going to show you how gevaldig it is now in the reading of the first Mishnah Berurah, okay? Let's look at the first Mishnah Berurah. What's the taam? Yeah, l'chatchilah's dakkos, yeah, aval lishbor, yeah, aval lishbor, chatichah mimenu shari, va'afilu im yozvu ktzas mayim al yedei zeh, d'lo miskaven l'zeh. He's not mechaven, v'oid sheholech l'ibud. The first one, the first in the beginning, you're allowed to cut it l'chatchilah's dakkos, right? So I had a shaylah how to read this Mishnah Berurah. This Mishnah Berurah would say that's all one reason: A is not miskaven, and also it's holech l'ibud. Ha'idilma the Mishnah Berurah is breaking it up into the two ta'amim. Atz taam of moled, then you have to say he's not mechaven, and atz taam of shechitas peiros is the heter holech l'ibud. Because the truth is, since when is there a heter of holech l'ibud on moled? I don't even know what he means. Which one is it? If it's moled, unless you say gevaldige chiddush, that even in moled there's a heter of holech l'ibud. How do you read these Mishnah Berurahs? Does the Mishnah Berurah put them together? Is it moled or shechitas peiros? Are we talking noiket l'dina both? So in the sevara of shem of d'lo miskaven and sheholech l'ibud is also meyashev both. Again, I want to walk away from tonight's shiur. I want to walk away from tonight's shiur. Listen to me. What's with the Panovich yeshiva's not here? I don't have enough guys for Panovich yeshiva. Huh? Very milking cows now. Check out milking cows now. On the floor, it's mutar. It's not תשעה באב, shechitah? No, it's mutar. You're allowed to do it on Shabbos. You're allowed to be ... says, you know, I'll do it. On the floor. Who's on the floor? You can do it with ... also. Yeah. Chazer Mishmurus is on the floor. It was shiur yesterday, you know. We were ... you know. ... Tarbal Chaim. We did this last time, okay, בקיצור, yeah? So the shailah is like this. How do you read this Mishnah? You read this Mishnah. How do you read this Mishnah? You hear my shailah? Is it one reason, or is it two reasons? Is it one reason? You hear? Is it one reason, or is it two reasons? Okay? What's the nafka mina? How do you explain? Again, here, l'chatchilah is דא, because it's mutar. Why? אבל יש ... ממנו ... אפילו ... One is the lo niskaven, and the second one it's ... Why is it? I mean, because it gets lost. Nothing happens to it.

I'll tell you where it comes out in the nafkamina. I'll show you, just to show you the nafkamina, the ice cubes and the sugya of ice cubes. When the ice cube melts into the thing, right, is it called heilech l'ibud? Why are you drinking? I'm drinking. Are you mechaven for the water in the ice cube? A lot of times you drink just the water, also the ice cube. I'm talking about into a soda. When you put it into a soda. No one's mechaven. No one's a soda. No one's a soda. If you don't want soda, soda. What's soda already? Drink. Soda. You put it in a drink. It really ruins it. You look at your Coke, it's like half white. You drink it anyway, because it doesn't taste good. You don't want ice cubes to melt. You don't want them to melt. Who wants ice cubes to melt? An ice cream that melts. That's how you drink soda. Ice cream. You don't... By understanding what we spoke tonight, it's perfect in all these, so we're gonna go through all the sugyas, slowly. So I want to tell you there's a gevaldige Iglei Tal. The Iglei Tal in siman lamed-vav — we got lost over here, so we'll do it again tomorrow. It's klar. I can't tell you how... Iglei Tal, siman lamed-vav, os yud aleph, says clearly that according to the Rambam, heilech l'ibud would be mutar, right? According to the Rambam, it's all about shechitas peiros, and by shechita there's a special heter that it has to be done l'shchita. You see clearly the heilech, the taam of moled. So I found the Tehila David learns like this. Tehila David says, according to the taam of moled... Tzadik, listen to me carefully. I know it's a long... You have no idea this... I promise you, if you come tomorrow again, I will make sure that you know it. I'll learn with you personally. No, I know, I know it's, it's, it's... You don't know how much I love this. He's a real yarei Shamayim. I want people to shul that yarei Shamayim. I'm not interested in anything else, okay? According to the Rambam, tam is of holech is al tzad shechitah. So then you have a sevara of holech l'ibud. Taktes, the teilah davar is like this. I don't know. Because you see, the Mishnah Berurah brings the tam of holech l'ibud. But I thought it's not only al tzad shechitas peh; I thought we pasken by libah also. Either it's bavarni one-one because we pasken or-or, or it's takah both together we pasken, and this takes care. The whole problem is, see, it's going l'ibud, so ... make up a kul. Maybe in the eino miskaven of shechitas peh this would be mutar, and maybe in the tam of moleit, holech l'ibud is also mutar. And I'm not saying anything more than just reading the Mishnah Berurah. I didn't say it. I'm telling you it has nothing to do with me now. Read the Mishnah Berurah. Mishnah Berurah brings both taamim. I'm just saying, so either shaylah how to learn up the Mishnah Berurah. Either the Mishnah Berurah means both taamim are true, and we takah pasken like both taamim in the Rishonim, or he means either-or. And then Afkeinu is how to reach shin chav-vav, because shechitas peh is, is the ikar shechitas peh, or is the ikar moleit, and maybe stam the Mishnah Berurah is saying there are taamim in the Rishonim. He's not saying it's lhalachah lmaaseh. How about the other way around? According to the tam of noylad... In the Rama, does the Rama hold of the other two taamim? That's a power. The way he learns the Rama of noylad, would he hold of the taam of the Rambam also, and the taam of Rashi also? Maybe he just holds of the sefer Trumas and finished. Where would the... where wouldn't you have? Because you have to know the sugya with the ice cubes, with the shechitah, and the hiluch l'ibur, and the whole sugya. I'm saying, we would knowled not apply. Maybe we would. See, the shailah is in their teirutz. Maybe if it's only, it's not us to do. It's not us to do. Maybe according to the taam of noylad, it's not us to do, the way we learn, in the maaseh. It's mamash a meridige nekudah. According to the Rama, the same way the Mishnah Berurah learns in the Mechaber that it could be both taamim, what about in the Rama that learns that it's al tz noylad? Do we say all three taamim, or maybe only say one taam? Huh? I'm not... I don't know. Why? It's muchach? That's not muchach. Okay, rabosai, we'll do it again tomorrow. Yeah, we'll do it tomorrow.

It's going backwards. Going backwards. Stop. Okay, let's go. You copy one, two, two? Yeah, actually. I hear. No, no, no, no. Heno. Now, ...

ChatGPT. Amen. ... Amen. ... Amen. Amen. Yomayo, yomayo.

I'm me. I'm me.

Anything is ... anything is not. ... dam ... dam for children. Just put the reason why it is dam for children, just for this reason. It’s a Torah. Wasn’t a Torah. Dam, why not? Because he didn’t need the children now. Wasn’t a Torah. Yes, you’re answering that. Rebbe, the first ... my question. We answered this. We answered that could be Chazalish calls everything a tzar. I’m saying this, it’s impossible. Pickles brings down also. Oh, pickles. He brings down the ... not the ... he brings the ... behind it. Chazalish. Most people. The famous ... everyone always gave me, yeah, but this thing’s ... in the way, and this thing ... The real answer ... ... doesn’t say anything. ... Who’s keys are these? Including this one? Yes. Yeah. Okay. Okay. I want to see that. ... Sasquatch is interesting. I just got me thinking ... my wife doesn't let me in the house. ... Yeah, you, you, you. ... I think Dorje, he wants to go home. ... I feel bad for you. I understand. I know the feeling. So Yitzi showed me what's going on over here. In case any husband would need a little snack. For Friday night or in general. Whenever in general. I think we should have a shalom cookie.