Shabbos 6a: Defining Reshus HaRabim, Platya, 600,000 People, and Karmelis

Transcript

What's a shuta rabim? It's platya. Platya. Gedolah umevu'atah biflushim. Platya. What's platya? says Rashi. Mesilah sheholchin bah me'ir le'ir, a highway, like, highway. Platya is a highway. Sheholchin bah me'ir le'ir. This is shuta rabim. Platya. What's platya? Chovah shel ir shesham mitkabtzim lischorah. A rachov in the city. It's a street in the city, shesham mitkabtzim lischorah. What about mevu'ot shel ir, rechavim yud-vav amah? Something that's open, rechavim, it's wide, yud-vav amah. Now, the first thing you have to ask is like this: Why do you need three cases for? What is the chidush in seratia over platya? What's the chidush of platya in the mevu'ot? You notice, you have to know what each one is teaching me, right? Yeah, same thing. What's the three cases? So the emes is like this. In the first case that Rashi brings, that it goes me'ir le'ir, does Rashi say how many people go there? Rashi doesn't say how many people go there. Rashi just says that it's a thing that people go from one city to the next. Meaning, it doesn't say how many people go there. It doesn't say how big it is. Any mesilah that goes me'ir le'ir, from Rashi's mashma, it's already what? A reshut harabim. Now, I'm not telling you that's true, but I'm just telling you what you see from the Gemara in Rashi. From the Gemara in Rashi, all you see is what? Anything that goes as a highway, me'ir le'ir. I don't know. You see, this is what I'm trying to say. For some reason... Rashi doesn't interpret what exactly makes that into reshus harabim. Is it the fact that a lot of people go there, or the mere fact that it takes you from one place to another place? This is called a throughway. This is called already reshus harabim. For example, if let's say you have a throughway in Honolulu. Now, I don't know, Honolulu might be very big in these days, but when we were young, they had an expression, Honolulu. Honolulu, some place, rachok, rachok mehayishuv. You have a throughway highway over there. You know, you go and you're not... Does that have a din of reshus harabim? From Rashi, the diyuk in Rashi, all you see is anything that takes you here to here is already called a reshus harabim. That's how you learn. Pshat. How many people, it doesn't say. How big, it doesn't say. It's already a reshus harabim. What about a platya? So Rashi says it's rechovah shel ir, shesham mitkabtzim liskhorah, that they come together for schorah. Now, here already it doesn't mention how many people, but it's mentioned people, shesham mitkabtzim. The lashon of the Gemara is gedolah. Notice that the Gemara puts in the word gedolah. Now, you see, pshat. You see how I'm going to teach you. Does the gedolah mean in size, or does the gedolah mean for people? How do you know? So it's not size, it's people he means. You see, it's the people. Maybe, no, I don't know. Maybe that's a different halachah. Then there's a third thing called the mavoi mefulash. There's something, there's a third thing. Since it's mefulash, mimakom l'makom, so therefore any yud-vav, that's going to be something else already. My question is like this. But Rashi explains, you see, again. I like pashut pshat to read. I like to read what it says. So the first thing when I read, I don't see in Rashi the first thing, sratya, people. I don't see sratya amounts of room, how big. It just says it takes me from one place to the other. Question mark. Does that mean that there's people there or no people? Does that mean that it's not big? I don't know. The Rashi doesn't say. I could say Rashi, no, it doesn't need people and it doesn't need to be big. As long as it takes you from one place to another, if for some reason, which we maybe see soon, has a din of a reshus harabim, then I read up to the second Rashi, and I see the word platya. Platya.

Why do we know there's a place for Shabbos Tapsim? So what's the diyuk I make in Rashi? The first diyuk I make in Rashi, that Rashi says the rechava shel ir. For some reason it has to be in the street of a city. Why can't it be a place that they gathered together, not in the street of the city? What's wrong with a gathering hall, you know where? Not in the street, not in the city, but it's michutz la'ir, let's say, and it's a kolosium. I didn't see it. So why does Rashi need that? So I'm asking, is that the metzius? I want to know, is the metzius dafka, and if it's not dafka, then don't give me this metzius. Is the case that it has to paka be in the city, or maybe not? And let me tell you, just to show you where I'm coming from. There's a teshuva of the Igros Moshe here, that he brings down the question that Rav Weissmandl asked. Who was Rav Weissmandl? There's a book about Rav Weissmandl. An article put out a book about him. He was a tremendous tzaddik who tried to save Jews from Europe, from the gedolim, Chashuve rabbanim. His koach was he was a very big rav, and his big thing was eruvin in Mikvaos, eruvin in Mikvaos. You know, he was... He was... He was... In fact, he hayah mitya'eh... mitya'eh... mi... mikvaos, mikvaos. It was very... So he asked a very nice question on the sugya of platya. What's the sugya of platya? Shamah mitkapsim becomes reshus harabim. So how come every beis knesses in Gadol doesn't have din of reshus harabim? Yeah. Yeah. That's what I'm bringing. Again, he wants to know how come every beis medrash gadol, what's the... What's the... Oh, one second. Of course, we'll soon see there's many shitos that hold that daled amos and mechitzah doesn't help you on a reshus harabim. It doesn't help you. It doesn't make it a reshus hayachid. It doesn't make it a reshus hayachid. We'll see. It's machlokes rishonim. We'll soon see. As the shiur goes on, you'll see the mareh mekomos: the Rashba, machlokes rishonim. So he asks the question, if so, we don't understand. How can it be that a beis knesses is not a reshus harabim? This is the question that Rav Weissman asks. So the ma'aseh writes to him, you hear? No, grab the Nazi. He says it's a kashya sh'tus. That's what he says. What's it—yeah, what siman did I write over here? Kuf lamed ches. Kuf lamed ches, let's see. The question is, if you learn that makom mitkabtzin rabim has halacha reshus harabim, so then what's the pshat that a beis knesses is a reshus harabim? This is the question. He brings down Rav Weissman's question, and listen to what he says to the question. It makes mincemeat out of it. He says, The hineh haRav haGaon Rav Rafael Ber Weissmandl shlita, b'sof kuntreso—he wrote obviously kuntresim, he wrote sefarim about Mikvaot and eruvin—b'sof mochiach she'pi tikra adif mimechitzah gemurah, shelo bati birkiat rabim afilu man d'bati bamechitzah. So b'kitzur, we're going to soon learn that could be, when there's a big public, the mechitzes don't help because the rabim come and ruin the mechitzah. He asks the question here. He says like this. We'll pluck you. He says here, Havei kol beis haknesses reshus harabim. He asks the question, let every beis haknesses be a reshus harabim. Says, Hamoysa d'kushya eino klum. This is nothing. This is a nonsense question. Why? D'gam haRaz b'modeh shema rabim tzrichim lihyos b'makom mukaf mechitzes, davka k'mo b'beis haknesses v'azarah b'Mikdash, hu reshus hayachid. If it's a place that's miyuchad for kibbutz rabim to be a makom miyuchad for kibbutz rabim, then we don't say. Matters is clear, God, there could be thousands of people could go there. So according to this, which we'll soon see, we're going to learn soon, if it's kibbutz rabim, it could be people. I walls, l'shunsi walls don't help. I'm telling you again, listen to the platya. Platya is a taich, rabim miskabtzim sham. That's the lashon of Rashi. Rabim doesn't say how many, but Rashi says rabim. So I'm telling you that once you see the rabim miskabtzim sham, I want you to keep in mind the word rechovah. Notice that Rashi said not a makom miskabtzim sham, but rather Rashi said one, a rechovah shel ir. It has to be in the street. So I ask you, why does Rashi say rechovah? Why can't it just be makom miskabtzim? And the answer is because makom miskabtzim is...

If that's true. A beis knesses is a makom miskabetz, and R' Moshe says hagufa makes it reshus hayachid. Since it's a makom miyuchad for rabim liskabetz, then that gufa becomes reshus hayachid. No, rechava means a street. But I'm telling you, the svara of rabim is rabim in a rechava. It's not a rabim. It's not platya makom rabim. It's platya in a rechava. I'm telling you, because if Rashi is telling me the metzius, and the Chazon Ish, so it comes out a very big problem. You know what the problem is? So then it comes out you can't daven in shul on Shabbos and carry siddur. That's the problem, right? And the answer is, it's not true, right? So why? Because Rashi takke says... walls don't help you. I keep on telling you, you'll soon see that in a reshus harabim, many shitos, many, many shitos, the Rashba shitos don't help you. Nothing. Nothing. Nothing helps. That's why you can't get an eruv reshus harabim. According to some shitos, you can put up walls and doors. That's one shita. The Rashba shitos, l'shitasi, it doesn't help. And the real pashut reason for the Rashba shitos, the Acharonim explains, atir rabim u'vatel mechitzos. It's finished. It's a rabim. There's no mechitzos here. They break the mechitzos. It doesn't mean physically we break it. It means that there's no— it becomes nothing. We look at it as a makom kibutz rabim and a... I'm telling you, meaning what do I want from you? What I want from you is to read, learn how to read a Gemara. Notice that Rashi said rechava. So the first thing that comes to your mind is why rechava? If the reason why it's reshus harabim because of kibbutz rabim, so let it not be a rechava. The answer is because not every kibbutz rabim. Train station. That's right. What do you think a train station is? It's a kibbutz rabim. You want to tell me a train station has walls and therefore it's reshus hayachid? If you carry them at the bottom of the train station, it's reshus hayachid? It's all mekureh, it's all covered over. It's reshus harabim. Why? Because of this reason. There's a dalsis. There's something else. Mechitzah is not b'dalsis here. We'll soon see. We'll see, we'll see dalsis. We'll soon see the sugya. Doors have to be closed and people can't get through. It's a whole business. Don't think it's so pashut. What? Rashi's telling you it's not enough that it should be makom kibbutz rabim. It has to be makom kibbutz rabim and the rechavah shelah. Now, the other diyuk that you should make is in Rashi. For some reason—I say, where else should it be? But how else do I mean the midbar? That's what he means. And a chinami, but it's not normal. There's no kibbutz rabim in the midbar. He tried giving me an example that's normal. Where is it normal? I'm telling you a story. What do you mean, a story? Let's say more. Sure, Moshe Rabbeinu. Avada, Moshe. But they like it. How many? Oh, that's your kashya. Oh, what was going on? I know. Oh, the platy means space. So rather there's a rash, but this is what I want to show you. That's why I want to show you the tour. Take out the tour. What's... what's... what? No, it's not the yud for kibbutz. Because rather there's people. You're not standing there to be there. It's to transit, to move. It's a... makom... It's a traveling. It's not kibbutz. It's not. It's not. You come together. It's not. Makom... Im ani ba li... im ani ba li... kabetzim im hatzibur. When you go to train stations, not to be with people. You'd rather have no people there. Technically it could be on top. It could be on top of the ground also. He's saying good, it could be on top of the ground also. It's not... It's a makom kibbutz. Even though it's plastic, it's... Dear friends... ...grada... ...tzamud... ...lebus stop. ...bishvil... In English.

There's no kinuyim. This is not mechudash. But train station, again, it has a halacha, platy gedolah. Since there's a rabim over there, but it's not with kavod. It's not meant with kavod. It's not because... You get a ride from there. It's not... It's not meant for... That's the distinction. Why? Just make it in the street. Why do you need a train station? So the answer is they wish they could, but there's not enough room up there. The reason why they don't make a train station on top is there's not enough room. They do. They say train stations on top of... There's no... on top. Forget. No, they're on top, but there's space on top. Simcha tells Simcha, Meir, guys, where are you going? I'm taking my wife out to the train station. We'd like to go there for an evening. Who wants to stay at a train station? It's only makom ma'avar. Train station is not makom kibbutz; it's a makom ma'avar. Okay, let's be careful. Okay, good, so we'll see maybe. You want to know something? Maybe, maybe, maybe he's right. I actually gave you an example. I'm not... Okay, that's one. Notice that Rashi, he didn't explain the gedolah at all. So pashut I would learn, the gedolah means it's a big room for a lot of people. I don't know why Rashi doesn't tell me how many people. Maybe it should be a level, what's called small. It depends. Let's say a hundred people come to my shiur in the morning. It's a lot of people. If a hundred people come to Am Yitzchok's speeches, it would be a very small crowd, right? It depends. It depends for what, right? What's called a lot of people? Don't say. How much? Don't say. Take a look at the lashon of the Gemara. This is gedayla. What's gedayla? Because there's a very interesting Tur. The Tur says, platya has to have a shiur. Read you the Tur inside. What's a platya? Sixteen by sixteen says the Tur. ... בואו ושווקים הרחבים שש עשרה אמה. Okay. ... גג, בית. One minute. Makom patur. What's that? Where is patur? Give him a daled? Hey, no, it's ... rשות היחיד, it's hey. Rשות הרבים ... שווקים. This is what you told me? That's zayin. Okay, zayin, whatever. Okay, so it says like this: רשות הרבים, רחובות ושווקים הרחבים שש עשרה אמה על שש עשרה אמה, ומפולשים משער לשער, ושישים ריבוא עוברין בו. חי אדם. ... I suppose the last ... brings it down from the Tur. I don't know, maybe I made a mistake here. איזה רשות הרבים? מקום שהוא רחב טז אמה על טז אמה, יש שווקים שבעיירות, וזה נקרא פלטיא, הרגיל בתוכו. I don't understand. We see, but what's that? Ushutra bim, churachavot, ushvakim. Ah, shvakim, that's where you get it. Shvakim is the platy, that's what it is. You see, I'll tell you where my mistake... Listen to where my mistake is. He explains shvakim is the platy. Yeah, I saw it. Platy. Here it is. Okay, okay, so this is where it comes from. You see, this is where my mistake was. The Chayei Adam quotes the Lashon, v'ze nikra platya, and I was looking for the Tur to where he says v'ze nikra platya. It's shvakim. Okay, good. So this is what it is. I'm sorry, this is my mistake. He says, ... makom shurachav ... v'ze nikra platya. So I thought that's the lashon, because he brings on the bottom it's the Tur. It's not the Tur. It's the shvakim is the Tur. Okay, shvakim, rechovot u'shvakim. So the question is, comes along the Nishmat Adam and he says, Tamuah! Tamuah! V'lo zachiti leida mekor l'zeh. Since when is a platya ... ... That's a whole shaylah, ... ... Oh, but who's the platya? Yeah. Maybe it's made as a street. Who asked? ... Oh, you want to say because once it's a...

Street has to be tezvai, but who says it can be a small street? The chai can be a small street for hilchos reshus harabim. You want to say, but you see, this is the point. We said street. Street can be small also. No, for reshus harabim, street can be smaller. No, but it's reshus harabim without the people. Because it's ten zayis in reshus harabim without the people. No, it's reshus harabim without the people. Platy is with the people. Platy became reshus harabim. Comes along the Tur, and he puts in that when it says tes-vav, it goes back on both, on platy also. Platy has to be tezvai. But what is it? He's just telling you what happened. So what is it then? What's the point of saying it? That's what the pshat is. That's lovely. It's all the same thing then. How do we know mavoi is tezvai? That's what he says. He doesn't know where it comes from. So mavoi tezvai is Rashi. Rashi said mavoi is tezvai, right? A rechav is tezvai to be reshus harabim. The question is, where in platy do you see that it has to be tezvai al tezvai? He quotes the Rashba, and he quotes the Tur, and he says, ... This is another way it comes from. And listen to his lashon: U'vigemara tzarichin, mashma d'kari al rechav reshus harabim tezvai amah. It's mashma that when it says yud-zayin, it's only for the street, for the street to be a reshus harabim, that's where you need tezvai al tezvai. But for platy, who says it's a shiur? He says tzarichin. Okay, whatever, tezvai. Okay, the question is, where in the platy, where do you have the platy has to be in order to be reshus harabim, ten zayis? So my question is, my question is, could be. When it says yud-daled, does yud-daled mean people, or yud-daled mean a shiur? I don't know. I don't know. But the Gemara, when the Gemara says it can't just be a what, it has to be what? A shiur. Why? Why Rashi said the word shiur? Please explain what it is. It's makom miskap. And then there's a shiur called d'varim. I'm not saying, I'm just throwing it out. You need shishim ribo, boys. Shishim ribo, right? Shishim ribo oivrim, boys. According to the sheetah, the sheetah says you need shishim ribo oivrim, boys. Then you would say a praktik doesn't need shishim ribo, as long as the makom miskap, good enough. If it's a makom kibutz, then it'll be good enough. Which we'll soon see. We'll soon see there's a chiluk between oivrim and kibutz. There's a chiluk in halacha. Again, yes, what is? Let me just finish answering. He's asking good. So then what do you need the kibutz for? It has the ten zayin. The teretz is, al trechaiv you would need shishim ribo oivrim, according to many shitos. Mashenkin here it's kibutz, you don't need shishim ribo. This is ... tonight. According to many shitos, ... But this tur, this tur that he's talking in holds ... Yeah. According to the Chayei Adam, the way he understands the Tur, you would need the people plus the shiur ten zayin. Then you would have to come onto a ... Meaning it would have to be mefulish, and it would have to maybe ... There would be nafkaminas in ... nafkaminas in ... Okay? We don't know where the shiur is. I'm just saying, if the word ... I don't know. So the Teretz is, what's the teretz? So let's discuss what's pshat in the shiur ten zayin, and the answer is, ten zayin is a makom gadol, and less than ten zayin is a makom katan. Obviously. That's what I'm saying. That's some ... In other words, ten zayin ama becomes a makom, a bigger place, and anything less, this is not chashuv; it's a smaller place. So ... there's another ... You see clearly, you see in Hilchos ... you need ten zayin. Chazal kiveya that let's call the big place, let's call the reshus harabim, a reshus harabim is ten zayin. ... but that's called ...

You know, the chiluk between big and small is, is what, rishus harabim, rishus hayachid. And could be, again, I'm not saying, I'm just throwing this out, maybe that the word gedolah doesn't mean gedolahs for the people. Meaning it's not pshat makom shemiskansim bo gedolah, a lot of people, but rather gedolah means that the makom is big. And pshat is, this is a shiur. If it's a makom katan and rabim miskansim bo, then you won't have this halachah. Maybe, like this tur. I don't know. Again, no, the Gemara never says a shiur. Even the next Gemara where it says, Mar bar Ravina ... doesn't say the shiur, huh? Yeah, I understand, but the shiur ... is not there. The shiur is later. That's when it says, zayin is a shiur, and that's the sugya, and the shailah is, does it apply to this also? The teretz says maybe it does. Yeah. The third case is mefulash. What does Rashi say, mefulash? Rashi says, mefulash, mishnei rosheihem liplatya, liplatya, liplatya. Mishnei rosheihem liplatya. The girsa on the side says, lisratya, meaning it's mefulash mishnei roshim. So there's a very big ... of the Rishonim, says the word mefulash go back on both cases. Meaning the platy also has to be mefurash mishnei Rashi, or it's only going back on Bavli. So for Rashi, if you have the girsa of mishnei Rashi lisrakya— What? I'm saying it's a pegel the girsa, right? And the girsa is liplatya, right? So if you learn the girsa is liplatya, then the pshat is just that the platya itself is mashma, it's not open. Because he's saying the din of mefurash is to the platya. I see it, but the pshat is it's two. If Rashi held that it's both, Rashi wouldn't say this to the platya. Rashi would say this and the platya; they're both mefurash. It means only the one way, the pshat has the one way, meaning the platya is one way, it doesn't have the other way. Right, that's the diyuk in the Rashi. Come, come, you with me? Again, what does Rashi say? Rashi says, mefurash liplatya. Oh, mashma the platya itself is not mefurash; that's the Rashi, liplatya. Why not? Why can't you read lisrakya, which goes from one side to the other, as platya and movaot have mefurash? They're both mefurash. Everything's mefurash, no? That also makes sense. Platya is what? It goes from one place—there's no... Again, you put a comma after the word movaot, or you put a comma after the word mefurash. If you put after mefurash, then you read platya and movaot, both of them are mefurash. U, u, u, movaot, u, mefurash, and everything's mefurash. Before you, there's nothing really to ask. You understand that you can read the word mefurash on both. Therefore, all I'm showing you is in the words of Rashi. Rashi explains mefurash. So Rashi says that it's mefurash both sides to the platya. So when he says to the platya, why could he say and the platya, not to the mavoi? Exactly. Exactly. And this is the Chazon Ish. The פירוש on the Tosafos, the very famous sefer. By the way, it's not a bad idea to get it. Mosnaim shel the Chazon Ish. They put it out; it's from the Kadmonim on the Tosafos. The Chazon Ish is very chashuv sefer. Had it costed any less, I would have bought it a long time ago. Make the diyuk in Rashi. Come, he wants to make the diyuk in Rashi. And Rashi learns—what does he mean? It's open on both ends. Open on both ends. Comes along the question that we have to ask from the Chazon Ish: does the word mefulash go back on platya also, or only on the word mavoi? He wants to say from Rashi it's mashma that mishnei rosheihem liplatya. B'grada, if you medayek in the words listratya, right, so maybe the platya, that girsa held is going on both. The girsa—I'm just saying the girsa that says mishnei rosheihem listratya, because he held that the platya was also part of it, going on both. The mevo'os hamefulashim is these two which are open, which kind of makes a lot of sense. You know why? All the streets lead into the highway. All the streets lead into the highway, so it's beautiful. Stratya is the highway, and then you have a platya, and then you have a mavoi, so they all lead where? Into the stratya. And then a chanami. It doesn't say like—it's...

What does Rashi say? What could Rashi not say? What? What? Stratgy we know means open up both ends. That we know. That's a fact. It goes from one city to the next. It's got to be open, right? Can't be closed. It's got to be a highway, a tunnel. Even a tunnel, it goes from one place to another. It's got to be an open thing. Good? Okay. So forget about strat. Now the question is, is platya open or closed? A shuk. They used to make the shuk over there, right? Is it open or is it closed? It depends how you read the lashon of the Gemara. Either you learn it b'fulash, it goes on— Not three. Two. Strat is out of the question. Two, or it's on the last thing. Comes along the Chassid, and he says, You look at Rashi. Rashi says it's open to the platya, not to the— Hear from the side of the Gemara that Rashi had the word stratya. So then what is that girsa learning? That's both of them. Mefulash means the two cases are mefulash, and they're mefulash to what? To the main highway, which is stratya. Now let's see here. Okay, now let's be careful. If you take a look, the Shitah LaRan brings down a shitah from the Ra'ah. The Taka learns this. The Shitah LaRa'ah learns that what needs—even the platya needs to be mefulash to the— He doesn't play with the girsa. I'm just telling you that this is in Rashi. The Ra'ah learns halachah l'maaseh. Halachah l'maaseh, how do you read the Gemara? So Shaila, how do you read the Gemara? When the Gemara says, according to Ra'ah means both. Side the platya has to be mefulash, and side—what?—has to be mefulash. Now if you look at Rashi, Rashi—I showed you, right? Rashi says clearly. Rashi says, U'mai reshus harabim... Trakia u'Platia, k'doylo. K'damer perek k'siya Shabbos, doymin bigdeimin chomer Shabbos mishtaminim, v'choil azli. Hilkach lo havi shtirah miyud vav amud, roichiv, u'mefulash mibeis Rosh. Oh, Rashi says, bo. Rashi is going back on Trakia and Platia, and he says, where do we know that it has to be mefulash? Because the diglei midbar were that way. That's how it was in the midbar. How was it? The degalim, shehaLeviim were b'roichav yud vav amah, they would go in the midbar. And therefore, hilkach lo havi shtirah d'Rabbanan batzir miyud vav amah roichiv, u'mefulash mibeis Rosh. What do you see from this Rashi? Once you learn like this, then I know where the yud vav amah comes from. Where does the Mishnahs Adam come from? It's a Rashi. What does he—? It's all learned from the diglei midbar. The same way, the same way that we say mefulash by Platia, because it's so to Platia end, both learned out from the diglei midbar. Anything that's diglei midbar, diglei midbar were yud vav amah. That's the next question. That's the second issue. Meileh, b'hechrach Rashi has to learn that what is it? Even the yud vav amah is going back on Platia. But what's the difference between Platia and Mavoi? Rashi doesn't have to say. Fine, and that's where we know from k'doylo. K'doylo is what it is. Maybe it's what it is. I don't know. Maybe you don't have ... love. Any little street could be good enough. ... I can't. What? I don't understand. That's where we know it's from. But it does tell me what it is. What is halachah? Halachah is, platy can be a small street, platy has to be gedolah. I'm saying maybe gedolah means ... I don't know. But one thing for sure, you can't be ... what's the makor is? The answer is biglei mipor. Hey, Rashi seems to learn clearly that you can't separate the two. Shvakim and rechovot, they're both have to be biglei mipor, just like both of them need mefulash, for the same reason both of them need what? But what does it mean, ...? What does it ...? You only six hundred thousand people to walk.

The ... a koy, the ... There's a machloikes, first of all, you might need ... and that will give you mechalek. This is klor Rashi. It's open Rashi. ... Yes. Take a look. We just finished now Rashi here in beis. The Rashba in Avodas HaKodesh seems to say an interesting chiddush. He wants to say that, you know, this reshus harabim, even if I put daltos, yeah, even if I put mechitzos, the Rashba — there's a very famous Rashba — that a reshus harabim, there is no way to do the house. Well, a house not, because then it becomes ... makom ... But any reshus harabim, you put up daltos, even if there's ... at night, it's not going to help you. This whole business that you always hear, put up doors, put up doors, you should know that according to the Rashba shitah it won't work. Rashba's shitah is daltos doesn't work. Comes along the Nezer. The Nezer says because ati rabim, the rabim come u'mevatlin mechitzasa. The famous klal that the rabim come and they ruin the mechitzah, meaning you don't have a mechitzah. You don't have a mechitzah. In New York City, in New York City, New York City. What's the svara behind it? It's very simple. Let's say you would take Ocean Parkway, right, and you want to close the doors, right, close the doors at night, huh? It doesn't mean physical. It means the fact that the rabim pass by there, so it's not existing. The mechitzah doesn't mean anything, because it's meant to be open. It's ... I'm telling you, in New York City. In New York City, they want, there's a tzad to say that we take doors, you hear? Doors at the end of Ocean Parkway and the beginning of Ocean Parkway, and one second in a 12-hour period, we should close it. Look, when nobody's coming, close it, and then open it, and that's not a reshus harabim according to many shitos. The Rashba holds that's not going to help you. You know why? Because since for 12 hours, anyway people are passing by, even if you put a mechitzah there, it's not a real mechitzah. It doesn't mean—because they're going to break. It doesn't mean physically break. The fact that the rabim goes there, that means it's not machutz. It doesn't mean it's not—it's batel. It becomes batel. The answer is, since according to many opinions, 600,000 people walk there, there is no way to make this into a reshus hayachid. Some hold I can put up doors, and the Rashba is mechadesh even doors won't help you. Comes along the Minchas, and he explains the reason why doors don't help. Why doesn't doors help? Because, ... it's a svara. It's a svara that ... mechrabim ... If you broke down the ... would you do it? Yeah, why not? You see, it's a very famous ... What's siman? Siman ... Kut. Yeah. ... First part of the teshuvah, he says you're trying to prove that we have today reshus harabim d'oraisa. ... another chelek of his teshuvah is doubtful. ... Doors. You can't lock the doors on Ocean Parkway because the government is going to rescue, right? Try to put up doors and they get away with it. It's possible to get permission. Huh? It's possible to get permission. Yeah, you get permission to lock the doors on Ocean Parkway for one second. Who cares? What? The question is if one second works. You're talking about locking the doors, right? One second. נמק. ... באתר זה יש רשות הרבים ... אף על פי ... פסח ... ... רשות הרבים ... ... Listen what he brings down. Listen what he brings down, the Rashba. He says like this, the Rashba, okay? You right here. ובדעת הרמבן ... ורבינו ... ורבין ומבטל מחיצות. ... דאינה פתוח לרבים בכלל. ... אלא רשות הרבים מקומו, ... משום ... דאתי רבים ומבטל מחיצתא.

The ikar ... of nifla, ein ... The ... here, tam is one of pshutim b'kam. No, he just says the ... same as Rashi. He doesn't say why. He just says, Asi rabim u'mvatel mechitzah. Tam d'also, ... eina pasuach l'rabim ... This is it. ... People come. Once people pass by, it's not going to help you. All the ... is not going to help you. The next thing, Ramban, which I want you to work on tonight. Ramban learns ... Yes, of course. Because since the ... since the makom is ... rabim, yuchalu ... rabim. Of course. Everything. Okay, so let me tell you. Tonight for homework, I want you to do this, and then we'll finish here. No, no, I'm just ... but I want to just tell you ... Very interesting Ramban in Eruvin. Ramban in Eruvin learns that when do we say ... not from makom dirah l'rabim, but rather from makom ... The way the ... learned, the Rashba, shitas, since it's a makom ... rabim, u'mvatel ... There's no door. There's no door. The Ramban learns the difference. The Ramban learns not just from ... It's a makom ... rabim, and from makom ... rabim, then the reshus harabim, then the mechitzah doesn't help. I mean, ... The heel will work. That's one of the heterim that everybody wants to use. Who says? Let's be somech on the Ramban. The Ramban was not a baki. He would chrabim that the mouth doesn't work, but a baki, he would chrab. Therefore, the mouth doesn't work. What do you have? You have to be something. What does? We're reading. Say it again. Af al pi. Say the ... There you go. Even if the door is closed, you have it right here in Shabbos, what do you have? ... Watch that even though the ... says the ... is going to help you, it's not going to help. Look at the Ramban. The Ramban says something to be ... to say breaking through by walking there, but any ... kibutz rabim, the mouth doesn't help. Why not? What's the chiluk between ... and ... like the Ramban, it makes sense. If the people are walking there, then it's not a door there. They get going to Ramban, they're not walking through. If there's ... kibutz, why according to Ramban it doesn't? ... The Ramban says ... right here, here, here. ... What does he seem to learn? That this halacha of ... ... if somebody's still there, it won't help you to close the door. It's not going to help you. ... If my day you can't close, it's why? Because people will ... About talking about that. Why? Why people walking? ... These are walls here. They can ... That's how ... Look around. Again. That's the word. Since people walking there, it doesn't help you to sort of ... It doesn't help you. ... Sometimes you close it by night, so ... opening it up. It's fucking ... they're walking there. What do you want? ... It doesn't help you to close. It doesn't help you. Why? Because ... People walking during the day. ... Whatever it is, somebody's doing the day. People are walking through, they're walking, they're walking, they're walking ... ... A lot worse. The thing that we say that the ... doesn't help. That's not for ... ... That's only for ... ... What's the difference between ... and ... ... Yeah. Okay, so ... Yeah, okay.

Yes, like he is. Since it's miyuchad, the ma'aseh says it's not a kinyan. We'll figure it out. Just for that. It's the last, last. In fact, we said over. The reason why I said over a ma'aseh before was because they get to... But also to get to what we talked about, kibud. Watch this. It seems, and we're going to get into this a little bit deeper as we learn the Gemara a little more, there's two types of reshus harabim. There's two types of reshus harabim. Two halachos in reshus harabim. One is be'etzem a reshus harabim. One is the reshus harabim, meaning because the rabim goes there, it turns into a reshus harabim. If you learn that it's תלוי on the metzius, that they go and they don't go, so the Rambam is saying, so let's see, can we put up a daas or we can't put up daas? If they're going there, we can put up daas; if it's a technical thing. If you're learning a makom kibutz, once it's a makom kibutz, it is reshus harabim. That's called reshus harabim. So to undo a reshus harabim, you can't undo it. How are you going to undo a reshus harabim? What, you put up a door? If you put up a door, now what? What do you want? Rambam miskabtzin bo. What do you want, the people in the... Okay, but it also depends on rabim. Rabim miskabtzin bo. That's the point. The point is, if you learn that rabim miskabtzin makes into a reshus harabim, so therefore just because you put up a door and you stop the flow of people coming or going, lemaaseh, there's a... it's a makom kibutz. But if you learn by the Rishonim, the chiddush is not a reshus harabim. That's the yesod. It's the going and the coming of the people. You want to read the Ramban. This is why we'll get back to the original shaila. Remember that we spoke about—what's it to explain? Very simple chiluk. When something is a reshus harabim because it is a reshus harabim, you can't undo reshus harabim mechitzah. Why it's not, whatever the reasons may be. Because the rabim there, we cannot do nothing. No, because it's l'maaseh reshus harabim; mechitzah doesn't undo reshus harabim. But mechitzahs could do is make that the rabim shouldn't come there. That's the most it could do. It doesn't undo the shem. It doesn't undo—let's say they went inside, now there is... No, they're there. They're there. Let's go and put up walls. That's not right. This is the fencing that makes—the fencing. They pave. Now close the door, they're not there. Let's say... In makom of kibutz rabim, you're going to build on that a stadium. I'm telling you, we're not talking about today, we're talking about... A delis is that it stops them. It stops them from walking here. Then they'll open the door and they'll come in. Then they'll go in. Finished. Now what do you have? It's a machlokes. If you come, you have a shuk. This is a shuk. You build a wall back to the shuk, it's not going to help anything. Shuk. Tomorrow you'll come and you'll see thousands of people standing here. What does it help you? I'll tell you how. You take a key and you open the door. What's the problem? The shul. What do you want? But if the shot is, avora, it's the going through that makes it. Magia, it's the going through. If I stop the flow, it stops the flow. I'll give a very interesting thing. It's a very interesting thing. Let's say you need a mechitzah here for a beis knesses. Windows enough? Is the window good enough? Enough. Technically, technically. The whole thing is mechitzah, not through. Mechitzah. It's not question of seeing through. Mechitzah you have. Windows are a mechitzah. Windows are a mechitzah, my friend. They have to paint the window. Technically, a window. Let's say you had a glass see-through from the floor to the ceiling, separate room. No, it's not. That's what you say, and that's what everybody says till Rav Moshe. Not in Hilchos Beis Knesses. Maybe, maybe, maybe. What about bathrooms? Hold on. In a car is the question of a mechitzah. Once you have a mechitzah, then it's a different ... It's 600,000. That's why. Over there, you're serious to see the ervah. In the bathroom, you're gonna see ervah.

Good, good. To make a separation between the... No, because you put mechitzah there. You don't need a mechitzah. You make it too bad in the bathroom. Yes. First teshuvah, look, look. No, b'di'eved, b'di'eved. According to the... b'di'eved, I karati. Also b'di'eved? Yeah. No, of course not the... B'di'eved. B'di'eved. On the window, possible. ...closed. ...Moskov. There's Moskov. ...there. There, there. Good. You want to say, for people drive at different speeds so they're not really connected. It's not one of the svarot he brings. One of the svarot he brings is this svara: svara is, since you're at a red light, you're stopping. Since you're in a car, you have nothing to do with the guy next to you. Another one of his very brilliant svarot is, take your... He takes a look, barfucks surrounded by a train station. Train station. He wants to say that those things become mechitzos because the... because... Again, some... is a teshuvah, his whole sefer. And the fact that he just recently put out another sefer just on it. Again, he's a tough cookie. He doesn't let go. Why? Now he's okay, because R' Moshe's not here. No, R' Moshe's not here anymore, so there's no... Today, all the... want to make the eruv anyway. ...became a champion. They all use him now. Everybody... the new sefer put out, everybody... All... put out the sefer. I want to bring it tomorrow. How do you know this? How do I know this? I have it. I read it. I read it. I went through it. Went through it. Brilliant. Every, every... every... He knows exactly what it says. He's a... wild. That's his problem. He's wild. Too much. He's wild. Very wild. How old is he? How old? You know what? We'll take him for a... Why not? How old is... You know, like he's... You know, the funny thing is... ...he's everything. He knows everything. No one talks about it. The problem is, he's very wild. What do you mean by that? Quick, quick. Yeah, that... Be a baal teshuvah. ...He has to be suave. He doesn't have... Everything goes. Brilliant. ...You can't argue with... He can get up at a dinner and start screaming about television, or he can get up at a dinner and start screaming about articles. He hates articles. He hates the computers and the fact that they put out a computer all to suck him out. When you interrupt him, he holds on to those CDs of pasukim. He says, You become your pasukim. No, you need rabbanim for that. It's only two about it. If the truth says, A equals B equals C, you're allowed to be... The truth is this, because from the computer it says A equals B equals C. ... Why? ... Why is it? ... Why? ... He keeps thinking the computer makes a decision. I don't... he doesn't talk. I'm talking about, could you find out how to hack a computer?

What about the computers? Very good. What's the big bit about it? First of all, I never heard about this program until... So what you do is you go onto one of these, and they have every Shas ... forever printout. They have the printout. ... This is what it says. So why go with that? I don't know. I don't have to go through all these ... Click on it. ... It comes. ... Every ... computer, and that's ... Every ... computer. That's what he wants. ... He discussed. He wants that. ... doesn't want a computer. That's what he wants. He's writing ... We're not writing knowing the big idea. You can get a fact book computer. Why not? Fact you can get. Why not? Good, for example. This is the case. ... Why didn't you prepare this up? Let me tell you, dollars. That's not what you're doing with it. You're finding the ... that talks about it. That's why you click on it, so you don't have to go through all this. So you can open the original book. Because the point is you have to read the whole ... You don't just go and read the... I don't get into this. That's not the point of the shiur. The point of the shiur is ... beautiful stuff. But the bottom line is, you have to walk away prepared for tomorrow, or actually for Thursday. What? Tomorrow. No, no. But we're not finished. But there's two dinim in ... There's ... But what ... The last seems to work, the simplest thing. If the ... go, if I could close the door, it should work. ... doesn't work. Comes along the ... and he says, since the ... goes, there's halacha, ... . ... But ... came, the Ramban is learning a different nekudah. The Ramban is saying, why should the ... work? Okay, now you have ... Now what? ... What is looking at Ramban? I just told you. The Ramban learns that it's ... In fact, if the ... goes back over there, turns into reshus harabim. ... He learns what makes a reshus harabim. In fact, if there's a ... going through, shimush harabim, shimush harabim, something that makes for shimush harabim, that's the chiluk: kibus harabim or shimush harabim. You hear the difference? Kibus harabim or shimush harabim. What's wrong? Why don't you listen? Right, these two words: kibus harabim or shimush. It's made for the usage of the rabim, or it's made for the fact that the rabim is there. Okay, now, what's the nafka mina? According to Rambam, if you hold that the kibus harabim ... by the ... , according to ... , the melo fregta kasha says every beis knesses. The answer is it's the yichud for that, which means that's why ... at the end of the Ramban, as well as I bring you to in the beginning. Now, what does it make? Now I understand the case of the ... Remember I asked you kasha: why does the Gemara ask to bring Trakia, Platia, and what we before? Three cases. Why does the Gemara need the three cases? Because I think ... One of them is ... One of them is ... One is shimush harabim. I try to say, it could be there's not even a robin that goes there. I want to say the first case of robbing, I don't even care if people are going there. But this is made for the use of the robin. It's made for the public to go in from. Tell me, what happens if nobody, sometimes, where does nobody go? Yeah. But that walkway's anyway. That's a public. Highway, highway. Case of the highway, I asked you, how come people go there? Nobody drives it. Might take me to Brooklyn. Because it's used for the— it's for the public to get somewhere. It doesn't make a difference, but it's made. It's made for the robin. It's made for the robin to use. That's the whole thing. When Clowey shows the desert, then it was good.

That's the three cases. One is ... One is kibbutz ... and so is ... So what's for ... and he will need to make people. Who says about ...? That's the ... The ... Maybe. He doesn't say that. He says, if you were the kibbutz maker ... so there he says ... doesn't work. In ... he says ... doesn't work if it's a kibbutz ... I'm telling you, ... would work. What? Again, what? ... What is my way? My way. ... Rabbi, my way. If ... Rabbi ... But what's ...? ... Tell you, halacha is not a halacha of how people go there. Halacha is not conventional. ... it's made public. What's the ... between my way? What's the difference between ... and my way? ... made for them, you would need the people. ... It's made for the rabbis. I don't care if people walk there. ... And if the people aren't going there, it won't work. What's my way? Supposed to go people? Is my way? They're supposed to go there? If not going ... This I will understand, maybe an interesting thing, this tour. And I don't know ... I'm not sure, you hear? ... about kibbutz ... about kibbutz is supposed to be there people. The shuter rabim, who are chavos u'shvakim. So what's rechovot? Rechovot would be what? Would be the— kibutz. Kibutz. What is shvakim? Shvakim is a platz. Which one is shvakia? Which one is shvakia? Kibutz. Which one, however? He gives two cases: rechovot and shvakim. How come he doesn't give the shvakia? And the Gemara brings a case. The Gemara is shvakia. It's always that way. I think something else. I think you take— I want to say something else. If you take a look, it says here, What's the tenai? ... the shishim ribui ovrei bo. The first shitah is you have to have shishim ribui ovrei bo. I don't believe by the ceiling you need shishim ribui ovrei bo. Why? Because it's under. I don't believe you need to set up people going through the thing daily. I think you don't need— there is— you don't need the whole— the people. The people is enough. It's enough that they could go there. You don't need the ... shishim ribui. It's enough for the rabim. By the rechov, in order for it to become a reshus harabim, you pasken needs shishim ribui, because it's not meant for so much. If you weren't in the ... so you would need the shishim ribui. Then you would need the shishim ribui. But if you weren't, it's reuy shibush, then you can be מסופק, talking about ... platya. Platya is ... And both, you need ... Me, what the Rishonim word— this is what I want to say— what the Rishonim word, that in a rechov, point to Rishonim... You know, even by 600,000 people going. What's the pshat? Since it's made for them to go, even if they don't go, it's good enough, is what the Tur holds the seela. What the Tur holds the seela is, is what the Rishonim hold l'chayim. But since he didn't want to bring the mesilah, the mesilah won't need l'maaseh oif. It's right for, for lav. Which comes out very chiddush. A highway, a highway, which is a highway, right, would be a problem if you don't have the numbers. I'll tell you what they did. They all came and attacked the Rosh with the numbers. They tried to bring with the biur, with the biur set. They went to the... Biur, biur. How many people can buy Ocean Parkway? How many people can buy certain...

You don't need to do this. According to, you don't need to do this. Right. What if you ... for 600,000 people? You don't need... That would be a big problem then. I'm saying, I'm saying, let's say... So then you have to go into the highway. Yeah. ...he wants not to go into the highway. ...Main Street... One day, one day, one day. One day, one day. One day, one day. ...he wants... ...Main Street... ...she removed this... ...Queensville. Oh, I didn't... I didn't... When something leaves into the main road, doesn't have a... ...I'm just telling you, there are three... One is shibusharabim, one is kibusharabim, one is hiluch harabim. Now I'm telling you, I understand... If shibusharabim means that... ...in your regular street... ...when it becomes a reshus harabim, that's... That's... That's right. That's why the issue. Why is that issue? You might need shishim. You might need just ... You have to count the numbers. That's something else. Balancing, it won't help ... That's another ... Doubt doesn't help by ... What? ... Anyway, you know, ... and it might help because it's not a ... It's right for ... if you stop the ... then it's ... If you stop the usage and it's not a ... because there are people ... But the doubt is good. ... The rabbotai, there's a simple question here. How come the Gemara doesn't say about carrying in it? The Gemara says that ... Shabbat. It speaks about motzi u'machnis, machnis u'motzi, motzi machnis. What about mav'ir b'toch ...? That's later. That's in the next case. It gives a case. The what? He brings the case, we'll say. ... You have it like this: ... Shabbat. He stresses, im hotzi u'machnis, he brings the case. Zuhi reshus harabim gemurah. What's a reshus harabim gemurah? ... reshus harabim ... Why does it have to say? Why couldn't it say, mav'ir daled amos? ... Yes, yes. ... Mav'ir daled amos. ... Once you say zu hi, that this is reshus harabim, don't say machnis u'motzi; even mav'ir is chayav. But he said later for a different case, in this braisa. But that's later. We're not holding. Right now, in this braisa, in this braisa, when it says it's later. In this braisa, where it says that halacha, reshus harabim, it should say, v'lo mav'irim mitoch daled amos. Now also another question. I understand, he's telling you chayav shogeg, chatas, mezid, ones.

Yeah, but within the dialogue of shuyot, this is one of the cases of dialogue of shuyot. Read further on. The Gemara speaks about kaf. And there it says clearly, ... Why does it say by shutafim? Simple question. Simple question. Also, what's the lashon of the Gemara, zu? Once you tell me what a shutafim is, ... b'shutafim, b'shutaf achin. What's the zu? What's the zu? Simple question. I can't scream. It says, Zu hi reshut harabim gemurah. Good. Ein motziin mireshut hayachid zu. So zu is not necessary. Ein motziin mireshut hayachid. Talk to me. Once you tell me this is zu. Once something is a shutaf... Once you say reshut hayachid and once you say reshut harabim, I see today everybody is in a good mood, Baruch Hashem. There's a wedding tonight. Relax, there's a wedding tonight. It's a simple question. I never saw where it should say that something is reshut hayachid, something is reshut harabim, and then the Gemara should continue, Ein motziin mireshut hayachid zu. Just say, Ein motziin mireshut hayachid, reshut harabim, finished. What is this zu? We'll see. That's the Gemara, that part we'll see. That could be, we could explain only. The Gemara speaks about it. What's the zu? What's the zu? What do you want, eimotziim mishum dechidzu? And if it's not mishum dechidzu, you can motziim, stop. Eim motziim mishum dechid... l'reshus harabim. These are two diyukim that you have to make. So let's see Rashi. Says Rashi. Says Rashi like this: Anush kares, what's anush kares? Belo hatra'ah. This is when there's no hatra'ah. V'nizkar b'hatra'ah. So this is the chiluk between kares and sekilah, with hatra'ah, without hatra'ah. Sekilah and kares. Why could Rashi say eidim and not eidim? Why could Rashi say eidim and not eidim? Why did Rashi have to say— It could be also b'hatra'ah or belo hatra'ah. You understand? So Rashi should have said, if there's no eidim, it's kares. No, because there could be a case of eidim, but they didn't give hatra'ah. Right, and there could be a case of hatra'ah and no eidim. Same thing, right? That's right. So what's wrong with this case? Right, so what's wrong? Why does Rashi say this case? What's wrong with saying the case of eidim and not eidim? Why could Rashi say this? This has eidim, this doesn't have eidim. What's wrong with this case? What's wrong with the other case? I mean, why should Rashi give a case that's not the only case? This is true. Should I give two cases, hatra'ah and eidim? No, you should give my case instead of yours. Oh yeah, and if hatra'ah you have one eid. ... When does somebody get kares? If there's no eidim, he gets kares. You understand? It's hatra'ah. You have two eidim and they didn't warn him, but he gets kares. If he had two edim and he didn't get a warning, he wouldn't get misa. Just say there's no edim. Yeah, but he wouldn't get misa, right? If you have two edim and they didn't warn him, right, he'd get kares. No, what I'm saying is, why should you... Why should you go like this? You could just say it in one word. Why should you—when there's no edim and they didn't give hatra'ah, and you should get... Hatra'ah, the not giving hatra'ah has nothing to do with edim. There could have been edim and they didn't give hatra'ah. One has nothing to do with the other. Just keep—you also have kares. I understand, but one second. How should the Rambam say? Nothing. Rashi should have said, with edim you have kares; without edim you don't, you have misa. Forget with edim, you have misa. So that's another—that's a case. That's one case in. Why give me a case? What's the most simple case of chiyuv and not chiyuv is edim and not edim. Right, Rashi should have said bli edim. Rashi should have said bli edim. That's what I'm saying, bli edim.

Watch what, say, ... That's right. I want to know why you say it. That's right. That's right. ... There's no edim. If Rashi was ... only edim, we would ask the same question by ... Right. Who says? Who says? Who says? Yeah, you need edim. The edim, they made the hatra'ah. Let's say two people give hatra'ah and two people say edus. Is that good? No. You talk like an am ha'aretz. These people talk like they know too much on Shabbos. There is one chiyuv that the edim ... and by the way, who says the edim have to be the ones that give you hatra'ah? It doesn't have to be that way. Who says? You have two people being matreh and two people saying edus. Tell me, do they both have to give hatra'ah? So let's say you have one guy giving hatra'ah and two people saying testimony. Rashi says, I ask you, why should you go like this? You need to go straight. That's what I'm asking you. Simple question: what's the difference in kares and not kares? When do you get karet, when do you not get karet? You want to know something? The funniest thing is, it's an open Rashi. Rashi says clearly, when a guy falls off the chimney, why did he fall off the chimney? Because he didn't have a ... because he's chayav mita. And what happened? What was the case? Remember Rashi says there was no edim. Rashi says there was no hatra'ah, Rashi says there was no edim. Okay, thank you so much. But you went like this and Rashi went straight. What's the case when a normal person gets a mita bidei Shamayim? He falls off a chimney. Says the Gemara, why did he fall off the chimney? He didn't have edim. According to you, he should say he didn't have hatra'ah. If it was edim, there was just no hatra'ah. You want to know when you get killed? Blozen. Why does it have to say, ...? Right. ... Why? Don't do it. Number one, what are those two? I don't see what you want. Don't do that. And then they did it, and they didn't see it. Or somebody else. I see. It's a simple... And I'm showing you that's klal in Gemara. The Gemara says, Mi she'nafal mehagag, ma omrim lo? Mi she'nafal mehagag. Stam hayah chayav sekilah. Why? Varagu hasav zeh, vlo hayah edim b'davar. According to you, it should say, vlo hayah hatra'ah b'davar. We would have thought that for kares you also need hatra'ah. That's the chiddush of Rashi. Rashi's trying to tell me a ... chiddush. Avada there's edim and not edim is the chiluk between misa bidei Shamayim. But if you would come and say for a chiyuv karet, a chiyuv karet... You need hatraah, kamashmalan you need hatraah. Why do you think you need hatraah? I'll tell you. I want to tell you over why you need kares. The chiddush is not for piki, you'll get kares. That's chiddush. So you would, because it's a chiyuv misah. But? So let's talk about it. Of course if there's no eidim, the metzius is you're not going to get מיתה. That's telling you chiddush that kares is b'loi hatraah. Afilu b'loi hatraah. So you would say maybe you need hatraah for kares, kamashmalan you won't get. That's where Rashi... I don't believe Rashi is trying to tell me the halacha, meaning the Gemara is there with me today. My throat is killing me. I'm having a hard time saying it over. It's Rashi. The Gemara never is learning to tell me what's chayav and what's patur. Meaning, we don't have to tell me in Hilchos mita. There's not a chiddush in Hilchos mita. Because of course, with eidim, and Rashi is saying a simple case: if there's no eidim, then you get kares. Rashi is telling me in chiyuvei Shabbos. Chiyuvei Shabbos, if a person was mechalel Shabbos, you know what his chiyuv is? If he did it b'meizid, he gets this. If he did it b'shogeg, he gets this. And if he did it b'loi this, then what happens? It's kares. Meaning, because I would say maybe you need what? Hatraah for the chiyuv kares of Shabbos. Why? So let me explain to you. When I was a bachur, I once discussed an inyan in a shiur. I said a chaburah, you take a chaburah in yeshiva. I said that Uzziah touched the Aron HaKodesh. Remember the story in Tanach? It moved, he touched it, and he died. Right, he died.

And he held it up, arono set nosav, and not the opposite. I hope I can do the... okay, if it doesn't last, you'll forgive me. I'm gonna try my best. Arono set nosav, and it's not the opposite. I asked the kasha. Good, whatever it is, HaKadosh Baruch Hu ... He didn't do anything wrong. He meant good. He meant to hold it up, right? But what chiyuv mita was? What did he do to be chayav? Tell me, which aveirah was he over? No, what aveirah? So a person does that, becomes killed? Any guy would be dead. And here's my drasha. So I'm saying, I want to know what issur did he do? What issur did he do? I'll tell you just what I said this shiur. This is what I said this shiur. I said like this: there's two types of mita bidei Shamayim. There's chiyuv mita bidei Shamayim, and then there's mita bidei Shamayim that Hashem says, I want to take you away. Finished. This is what I said this shiur. A kach kenenu too, v'kila kach Elokim. The Borei Olam has a cheshbon. He says, I don't want you. He could say it like this: Ein lecha zchus kayum. I don't want you to live, that's all. It doesn't have to work with dinim. It doesn't work, avarta, v'yesh chiyuv mita al ma she'avarta. I said that by Uzia, it was like Hashem said, to teach this lesson, I'm gonna do it. Give me a mashal, give me a mashal. Good, whatever. Also, nosa will be a chilul Hashem, whatever it was. Whatever, I gave an example here, Parah. We spoke last week, Pari had no bechirah, right? Pari had no bechirah. ‘Hayitachen’ is against the teretzes, special for Pari, according to the Baalei HaTosafos, special for Pari. What's the pshat? You're right. There's certain times the Ribono Shel Olam says, ‘Ani samti lecha, I put you over here and I'm taking you away, that's all.’ It doesn't have to be a vart of the yesh dinim shatach al averah b'zeh. It doesn't go with the book. That's the Ribono Shel Olam. Not b'kesher luziyach. Right, but he wanted an aveirah; he didn't do anything more. It was a lesson to teach, ‘Ha'aron nosa es nosav,’ that's all it was. What aveirah did the guy do? He didn't do anything. So where does it say in the Torah, ‘I'll do what he did’? No. To teach ‘Ha'aron nosa es nosav,’ the Ribono Shel Olam took him away. To teach this lesson. See, you'll be ... even too. It had nothing to do with what he did. It's not he did an aveirah. It's not a din. It's the Ribono Shel Olam teaching al yedei—it's a limud al yedei this person. That's what we see from Pari. In din, off. There's two types of chiyuvim. So I said off. So this is what I said. This is what I said in the shiur here. I remember the bachurim went crazy. My friend—the bachurim in the shiur started fighting. My friends were all upset at me, ‘Hayitachen, I'm allowed—what right do you have to say a thing like this? What right?’ Brisk wouldn't say it, he had no right to say it. They made a whole tirade. ‘Hayitachen, you heard what the ... said in the shiur today? It was terrible. It was a big story.’ You know me, I don't get mispoel. I don't get mispoel mishum davar. I told them, ‘I hope you're wrong. I think I'm right.’ Two days later, I went looking in the teshuvot to find a makor for this. Rav Moshe says it clearly, this yesod. There's two chiyuvei mita. There's a chiyuv, chiyuv mita, and then there's mita where the Rabbeinu says אין לך פטור. I don't want you to be here anymore. Finish. You know, an English expression: I need you. You never see the father screaming to the child, I need you. It's a famous expression: I need you, you listen to me. I brought you to this world, and I brought you to this world. That's what the Rabbeinu is saying. That's zchutki, and I'm giving you zchutki, and I hope you don't want different. I showed the Rav Moshe wrote it, and Rav Moshe said it, and I showed it to them, and the ... everything became very quiet, ... everything became nice and quiet. The Rabbeinu, I think, has to do with this yesod also. Chiyuv kares is what? It's a chiyuv, pshat. Beis din couldn't do it, so the Torah takes the chiyuv of beis din and does it for them. So that's why I have havamina you should have terach. What's the chiyuv mita and not chiyuv mita? But if you learn that it's stam like a mita bidei Shamayim.

Huh? Anyone, it should be more. Whoever it was, it should be more by it. You need hatra'ah to be get kares. The same way the chiyuv of beisin has hatra'ah, so too the chiyuv Shamayim has hatra'ah. ... kares is בלי התראה. Pashut, if there's no eidim, you get kares. And the Gemara is not trying to tell me the metzius that if a guy doesn't have eidim, he's not going to get misa. That's not the chidush here. The chidush is trying to say, what is he chayav? Chayav in beis din is with hatra'ah. Chayav in Shamayim, chayav is בלי התראה. No, no, I'm saying—huh? Why is it not? So the truth is, I can answer you. There's a Mishnah Melamed that asks your question. Mishnah Melamed explains your kasha. And he says it's a very big chiluk. Why? The Gemara says, Le nitan hatra'ah ela lehavchin bein shogeg l'meizid, to tell the difference ... because why? Maybe you don't understand what you're doing, but Hashem who knows ... The Gemara says that a talmid chacham doesn't need hatra'ah. According to many opinions, the בעל מחבר doesn't get hatra'ah. Why? Because the whole hatra'ah is to make sure you know. Maybe you think you're not doing—maybe you think it's mutar. Maybe you don't see what you're doing. Nitna hatra'ah ela l'hachin bein shogeg l'meizid. HaKadosh Baruch Hu doesn't have this problem. In Shamayim they know clear, and then a chanami. If the person דווקא didn't know 100%, then you won't get the correction. You won't get the correction. Thank you. Even the chiyuv kareis is bli hatra'ah. Even the chiyuv of kareis, chiyuv mitah. If he's trying to tell me the metzius—of course metzius is one with eidim, one without eidim. That would be with eidim and without eidim. He's trying to say, what are you chayav for? You're chayav b'shogeg for this, you're chayav b'meizid for this, you're chayav kareis even without hatra'ah. That's what he's trying to say. What do you mean? What do you mean? What do you mean? Right. I think Rashi is trying to break it up: anush kareis v'niskal. It can't be both. It has to be one or. He divides to one or. Because otherwise you'd read it anush kareis v'niskal, and it's not true. You don't get both. So Rashi is anush kareis, period; v'niskal, period; and the period is because of the word hatra'ah. That's Rashi. So I ask you, why couldn't the periods be because of eidim and not eidim? Even though eidim is a point, there's a chiyuv. What's the chiyuv? Hatraah is mechayev, and I would think ... Eidim is a raya. Eidim is a raya for, not a chiyuv here. Okay, let's move on. Right, what? I don't understand. You don't understand? Right, what? Maybe. Eidim is a metzius. Who do you want to say in two words? Eidim is ... I mean, ... Hatraah is ... Eidim is a metzius. Even if you don't have eidim, of course there's no chiyuv mita. Who knows about it? Nobody knows about it. The fact is, there's no ... So notice, Rashi wants to see more than just the fact between the two. Rashi wants to explain a chiyuv. There's a chiyuv kares, and there's a chiyuv mita. What's the chiyuv mita? The chiyuv mita is with hatraah, and the chiyuv skilah is without. Who? You could. You don't need hatraah, but loi hatraah. He will have hatraah. Let's see further. So remember, the first kasha that we asked was, how come it says ... and also the ... How come there's no ... in that? Okay, we'll soon get back.

Continue. Avu yamu bika, v'istavonis, v'akarmelit, eino lo kirshus harabim v'lo kirshus hayachid. It's not like reshus harabim, it's not like reshus hayachid. Rashi says, Rashi, bika. What's a bika? Sados harbeh, many fields. Istavonis, lifnei hachanuyos. That's before the store, they have like a thing, istavonis, yeah. Sheyoshvim sochim, the sochim sit there, right? Karmelis. V'kamei parach, ha d'kol hani yamu bika, lamah hu karmelis? Meaning, karmelis is the name of the whole business. Karmelis is not a thing. This is a table, and a table is furniture. The furniture is the name of the chef davar, and the thing the product in it. That's the kasha. The Gemara speaks about it. Now. No, lifnei ... karmelis. Now, lo kirshus hayachid. So, like kishut hayachid, so let's see the lashon. It says, it doesn't say what it is; it says what it's not. Yam ubika. It doesn't say what it is; it says what it's not. What's the pshat? So we'll see Rashi. Lo kishut hayachid mishum dami lreshut harabim. It's not a reshut hayachid because it's not domeh to reshut harabim. Why? Dein la mechitzah. So if it is, come and say why it's not reshut hayachid. Don't tell me why. Lo kishut hayachid. Just say it's not reshut hayachid. Ein la mechitzah. Why is it? Okay, so this is maskim to. Maskim איתי. Here, let me talk to you. What is this? It's not a plate. It's not a plate. So why would you say it's not a plate? So first of all, why? Tell me what it is. Don't tell me what it's not. So first you tell me what it's not. It's not a plate. Also crazy, right? Then you explain to me, you know why it's not a plate? Because it can't be compared to a plate, then it should be called a cup. So why? Just say what it is and what it's not. First of all, what do you say what it's not? Tell me what it is. Now you tell me what it's not, and why is it what it's not? Well, come on, fine. Yeah, obviously. And even when it's what it's not, we're saying what it's not. What is it? It's not a reshut hayachid. Dedamya lreshut harabim. Reshut hayachid has mechitzos. So you don't have to explain the damyon lreshut harabim. And then it says, lo kishut hayachid. No, because it has a mechitzah. Is the reason why this ... has no mechitzos? Rashi should have said, Lo kishutei achis, mishum d'ein la mechitzos. Explain me why. Why? ... No? ... I mean, what do you need that for? Why could you just say simply, it's not a reshus hayachid because it doesn't have mechitzos? Again, a double negative.